burning audio files on DVD

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burning audio files on DVD

2005-05-01 11:14:17

Hello,

I've bought a DVD burner, and receive it yesterday. I need it to backup my audio collection, which only live on fragile HDD.

It's my first DVD burner. I haven't tried yet (not installed). Are there some elementary advices or recommendation before burning DVD-R? My computer is a slow one, and I've read this precious information.

My main concern is filename length. It was an issue with CD burning too, but it was solved by using the pretty useful burn-at-once application, which allows some very cool ISO features I haven't seen on other big burning softwares. Apparently, I can use these ISO settings with DVD-R/DVD+R as well, and burn files with ~200 characters as filename. Is that OK? Is it stupid? Are compatibility issues possible with it?

What about par/par2? Some people are doing it. It's apparently recommanded, but I find it painful (I don't know that program very much). I recently read that people are doing par for their ISO files. It makes sense to me. What do you think?

Thanks

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #1 – 2005-05-01 12:54:43

Quote

Are there some elementary advices or recommendation before burning DVD-R? My computer is a slow one, and I've read this precious information.

Well... I'd say, the main problem is the quality of the disc and the quality of the burn - much like with CD burning. You have to find the discs your burner will like and which will last at the same time. It's possible to have a good burn on a low quality disc and have it unreadable in a couple of months. This is a bit of an extreme example, of course.

You will find loads of information on the subject at http://club.cdfreaks.com, along with testing software, modified firmware for some drives (some of those files can get you better recording quality and/or higher recording speeds) and a lot of other things. I'm sure you can already know about it and I'm sorry if I'm stating the obvious.

As for the thread you linked, out of my personal experience, I can say: avoid Nero. I can get perfect burns at 8x using BurnAtOnce with ProDVD (works like a charm ), but usually I can't record faster than 4x using Nero - the burner just seems to be unable to stay at the higher speed for more than a fraction of a second then. Which means literally dozens of buffer underruns/linking points per disc. Nero used to work OK, but newer versions somehow don't.

Quote

My main concern is filename length. It was an issue with CD burning too, but it was solved by using the pretty useful burn-at-once application, which allows some very cool ISO features I haven't seen on other big burning softwares. Apparently, I can use these ISO settings with DVD-R/DVD+R as well, and burn files with ~200 characters as filename. Is that OK? Is it stupid? Are compatibility issues possible with it?

AFAIK, only WinXP and higher support ISO9660:1999, so it could be a kind of a compatibility issue, I think. I usually use the most basic ISO setting, plus Joliet with longer names, plus UDF, plus RockRidge. I don't think it's really needed, but one of these FSs just should work.

Quote

What about par/par2? Some people are doing it. It's apparently recommanded, but I find it painful (I don't know that program very much). I recently read that people are doing par for their ISO files. It makes sense to me. What do you think?

Personally, I don't use them, but it could be a good idea.

Regards.

edit: typos, etc.

edit #2

Not every dvd drive can read DVD+R/W discs. I'm pretty sure all the modern drives do, but if you want the discs to be readable by some old hardware, you may want to use DVD-R/Ws or have the Book Type for DVD+R/Ws set to DVD-ROM. Most of the drives should be able to read them then.

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #2 – 2005-05-01 13:10:40

Thanks for your answer. I've bought a LG burner with 50 DVD-R and 50 DVD+R from Verbatim (MCC 004) labeled at x16 (but I don't think that my Duron 800 could handle such transfers). According to cdrinfo.com, it's a really good combination. I don't plan to backup my audio on cheap and unsure media

support ISO9660:1999 & XP> I ignored that. Thanks for this info. You're apparently familiar with Burn-At-Once. Could you tell me how the software react when filename are too longs? I remember that Nero (it was a looong time ago, and it's probably corrected since) used to cut the name but also remove the file extension I could live with truncated filename, but I prefer keep them. I could of course exploit my tags to quickly rename all files with short filename. Not a real problem - just a matter of comfort

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #3 – 2005-05-01 13:21:58

Quote

Thanks for your answer. I've bought a LG burner with 50 DVD-R and 50 DVD+R from Verbatim (MCC 004) labeled at x16 (but I don't think that my Duron 800 could handle such transfers). According to cdrinfo.com, it's a really good combination.

Yes, it seems to be.

Quote

Could you tell me how the software react when filename are too longs?

I'm sorry, but I just don't remember. I had this happening to me twice, but the details escaped me, as I threw the disc to the trash. In the second case, I remeber seeing a message about a file name too long in the BAO's window (down at the bottom) and I terminated the process before it got to the lead-in, but that's all I can recall.

BTW, I added a bit of an info on readability of DVD+R/Ws to my previous post. Please check.

Regards.

edit: typos, etc. - again

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #4 – 2005-05-01 13:38:02

Thanks again.

I have another question, to you or someone else. My audio tags, and to some extend the filename of these files contains some unusual characters. A normal person would name his file/tag:
Concerto No.5 "Emperor" - 1. Allegro

guruboolez named this file:
Concerto No.5 „Emperor“ • 1. Allegro

I wonder... „ “ • — etc... are not very common. There are apparently no problems with files named with these characters on a XP based system and on NTFS/FAT32 formatting. But I don't know if the ISO/JOLIET/UDF filesystem could normally handle files containing rare letters. Does someone know?

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #5 – 2005-05-01 14:06:11

Well, UDF supports Unicode, so I think it should handle most of the unusual characters. But with both Nero and BAO there is a problem: the programmes themselves do not handle some of the strange characters, despite the theoretical ability to write them.

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #6 – 2005-05-01 14:14:34

Quote

But with both Nero and BAO there is a problem: the programmes themselves do not handle some of the strange characters, despite the theoretical ability to write them.
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=294550"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Fortunately, I've add 4 DVD+RW. I think I'll begin with some tests before the big backup operation
Does someone know other "good" free DVD burning application?

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #7 – 2005-05-01 14:18:44

DeepBurner and CDBunerXP Pro come to mind, but I can't comment on their ability to handle unicode characters, as I used them both only a few times. But I hear they are decent.

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #8 – 2005-05-01 16:06:43

Guruboolez, I've bought a DVD writer a while ago for the same purpose as you. I have payed attention to the writer/media combination, but for the rest I've just gone ahead without worrying. I don't know the answers to many of your questions, but I'll contribute the few things I can

I burn with Nero/Win2k in UDF mode. It cuts long filenames (but it does not remove the extensions) but there might be a solution for that that I'm not aware of.

I have some experience with using PAR2, but the answer to the question whether PAR2 is worth the effort, is one that probably only be known after a few years, just as it happened to CD. By then we will have an impression of how reliable the media are, based on media R.I.P. threads If DVD media quality is comparable the quality of the latest CDs, then I wouldn't worry. However if it's rather like the quality of the earliest CDs then there is reason to worry Keep reading those forums!

The drawback of PAR2 is the time needed to create them (proportional to the amount of recovery blocks and a typically a matter of hours per DVD). FYI I made 100 1MB blocks per DVD = 1.5hours on my AMD Duron 1300. A 100MB is much less than what other people use, but they're based on an ISO image of high quality DVD media and that should suffice IMO.

That was how I used to do it. Actually nowadays I find PAR2 too much of a hassle. I reckon that the DVDs will last for at least a year or 3. By then there might be a new generation of media, to which I will transfer the data. Or else, I might rip all DVDs to HD and Sweep-PAR2 them all at once in a night. We will see, I don't worry for the first few years.

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #9 – 2005-05-01 17:57:27

@guruboolez:

One other thing to keep in mind. Most of dvd readers (not burners) can't read anything after the first session. Multisession dvds are therefore a compatibility issue, too.

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #10 – 2005-05-01 23:06:59

One feature I consider absolutely essential for a burning app
is the ability to verify burned data. Nero has that option, but
many other respected burning applications such as Burnatonce
and VSO Software's Blindwrite and Copy-to-DVD, don't.

To those who use the aforementioned apps which lack a data
verification capability: Don't you guys feel the need to verify a burn?
Or do you just put blind trust in a respected burn engine and a good
drive/medium combination?

Personally, I would feel rather uncomfortable not knowing for sure that
my newly recorded CD/DVD actually has all the correct data on it...

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #11 – 2005-05-02 10:14:46

Thank you for all advices. I think I could begin to safely backup my files

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #12 – 2005-05-02 10:40:43

Quote

One feature I consider absolutely essential for a burning app
is the ability to verify burned data. Nero has that option, but
many other respected burning applications such as Burnatonce
and VSO Software's Blindwrite and Copy-to-DVD, don't.

To those who use the aforementioned apps which lack a data
verification capability: Don't you guys feel the need to verify a burn?
Or do you just put blind trust in a respected burn engine and a good
drive/medium combination?

Personally, I would feel rather uncomfortable not knowing for sure that
my newly recorded CD/DVD actually has all the correct data on it...
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=294648"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I agree completely, data verification is an absoloute must. But there are ways to do this manually* if the burning app doesn't support this feature. Ofcourse, it would be nicer if it was integrated into the burning app.

*FC from a command prompt, BFC command line tool, there must be some GUI alternatives too.

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #13 – 2005-05-02 13:07:19

Quote

My main concern is filename length. It was an issue with CD burning too,
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=294534"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

If you can't find burning program that likes your long/odd character file names, you can step around that issue by containing your audio files in archive files such as zip, gzip, or tar. That way the burner just sees a data file with a nice simple name. Of course you couldn't just play the files directly off the disc; you would have to extract them back to hard drive to play.

Be sure to make the archive with whatever option is there so the program won't try to compress your audio files as it will just waste time with no benefit.

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #14 – 2005-05-02 13:14:59

Quote

To those who use the aforementioned apps which lack a data
verification capability: Don't you guys feel the need to verify a burn?
Or do you just put blind trust in a respected burn engine and a good
drive/medium combination?
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I put also MD5sums of all Files on the CD/DVD, so I can check it every time I like.
A very nice and free md5-checker for windows is fsum [a href="http://www.slavasoft.com/fsum/]http://www.slavasoft.com/fsum/[/url]

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #15 – 2005-05-02 13:16:29

DonP> I'd like to store audio files without putting them in zip or anything similar.

For long name, BurnAtOnce can do it perfectly (I did it many times with ISO CD-R, but at this time I only used characters available directly on keyboard). Now, I must see if BAO:
• can also do long filenames with DVD
• can handle specific characters, even if they are not displayed properly by the burning application.

Anyway, thanks for the tip

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #16 – 2005-05-02 15:27:49

Quote

Quote
To those who use the aforementioned apps which lack a data
verification capability: Don't you guys feel the need to verify a burn?
Or do you just put blind trust in a respected burn engine and a good
drive/medium combination?
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I put also MD5sums of all Files on the CD/DVD, so I can check it every time I like.
A very nice and free md5-checker for windows is fsum [a href="http://www.slavasoft.com/fsum/]http://www.slavasoft.com/fsum/[/url]
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=294783"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Having a md5 to check the CD/DVD is nice and all, but it's not
really easy to make a single md5 for multiple files when the files
can be in different folders on your hard drive...

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #17 – 2005-05-02 15:34:38

Ehm, the first thig I'd recommend is to grab yourself a DVD–RW disc and have a few experiments out there. (The disc will proof itself usable anyways, so it isn't a loss of money.)
It's already late, though.

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #18 – 2005-05-02 15:39:32

Yes, it was planned from the begining. But tests are not necessary enough, and can't fully replace experience from other users. That's why I asked first

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #19 – 2005-05-02 16:23:03

Quote

Having a md5 to check the CD/DVD is nice and all, but it's not
really easy to make a single md5 for multiple files when the files
can be in different folders on your hard drive...
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=294812"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

To create recursive MD5s is very easy with fsum and the -r switch

Code: [Select]

fsum -jm -jnc -r -dc:\temp\ * >c:\md5sum.md5

edit:
Ahh.. I see, you are talking about files and folders on different locations, e.g. c:\dir_1, c:\dir_2, c:\dir_xyz etc.

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #20 – 2005-05-02 18:26:49

"Recursive" MD5 hashing is supported by Easy MD5 Creator.

BTW PAR2 hashes as well and has the additional advantage that damage can be restored. You can do a recursive PAR2 as follows: search & select all files in Win explorer and process them all with QuickPar. Recovery could happen after copying all files from the DVD to a folder on your HD or creating an ISO.

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #21 – 2005-05-03 01:57:44

Quote

One feature I consider absolutely essential for a burning app
is the ability to verify burned data. Nero has that option, but
many other respected burning applications such as Burnatonce
and VSO Software's Blindwrite and Copy-to-DVD, don't.

To those who use the aforementioned apps which lack a data
verification capability: Don't you guys feel the need to verify a burn?
Or do you just put blind trust in a respected burn engine and a good
drive/medium combination?

Personally, I would feel rather uncomfortable not knowing for sure that
my newly recorded CD/DVD actually has all the correct data on it...
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=294648"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Just verifying the data really isn't usefull. That just means that it correct *right now*. What I feel is more important is using a tool like CD/DVDSpeed or Kprobe to scan a burned disc for errors.

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #22 – 2005-05-03 09:16:09

Quote

Just verifying the data really isn't usefull. That just means that it correct *right now*. What I feel is more important is using a tool like CD/DVDSpeed or Kprobe to scan a burned disc for errors.

Well, scanning for errors is of course very useful, but a good scan
alone can't guarantee that data on the disc is intact, whereas a checksum
file can. And I wouldn't say a verification of a burn isn't useful. At least it
informs you that the burn went well, and that you needn't repeat it.

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #23 – 2005-05-03 09:48:48

Quote

Just verifying the data really isn't usefull. That just means that it correct *right now*. What I feel is more important is using a tool like CD/DVDSpeed or Kprobe to scan a burned disc for errors.
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=294927"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

All those other tools are doing is showing you what's happening *right now*. Data verification isn't useful?

burning audio files on DVD

Reply #24 – 2005-05-03 14:19:14

I think the point is that data verification just tells you that the data can be read back *somehow*. It does not tell you how good your burn was. It may well be that the burn was marginal in quality (i.e. very high error rates, but the drive can still recover the data without errors). On the other hand, if you scan for PI/PO erros, beta/jitter etc., and get very low error rates, you can be relatively sure that you have a good burn which will work in most players and which will probably still be readable in a few years. A quick alternative would be a read transfer test - if the whole disc can be read back at full speed without the drive slowing down, it indicates that you probably have a good burn without massive errors. All this is much more useful than a simple data verification test, which just tells you whether your disc is a coaster already half a minute after the burn completed.
IMHO, a read transfer test is probably most useful for everyday usage - a quick and easy way of checking the quality of a burn. Plus, it can be done with any DVD drive.

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