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Topic: When does iTunes MP3 = Lame Mp3 (Read 6974 times) previous topic - next topic
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When does iTunes MP3 = Lame Mp3

I use LAME aps for encoding my MP3s and am happy with the sound and file size.

However, I have just introduced my girlfriend to the joys of computer music via iTunes. She is not especially computer literate, but can manage to rip CDs with iTunes since the process is so quick and seamless.

She's not as fussed as I am about audio quality, but it would be nice if her encodings were of a similar quality to mine for when I visit or she sends me things to listen to.

So any thoughts what setting I should set up for her - would 225 VBR Highest do the trick, or 256. Or even 320 CBR?

Thanks for all thoughts.

Steve

When does iTunes MP3 = Lame Mp3

Reply #1 –
You should test several bitrates by yourself, really. That's the only way to be sure the quality will please you. Specially considering the iTunes encoder, that is not particularly popular here.

When does iTunes MP3 = Lame Mp3

Reply #2 –
Anyway there will be still potential ripping errors since i doubt iTune will be as secure as EAC for audio extraction... :s

When does iTunes MP3 = Lame Mp3

Reply #3 –
The iTunes MP3 encoder is not the best MP3 encoder available but I wouldn't call it incredibly bad.  Compared to LAME, sure, the iTunes encoder suffers greatly.  But I think if you have your girlfriend use a high enough bit rate with the iTunes MP3 encoder that you can get quality that is transparent to your ears.  Since she doesn't care much about audio quality I doubt she'll be picky on a bit rate setting.  Just tell her what to use and I"m sure she'd go with it.  I personally got my girlfriend into iTunes since I use the program a lot myself now.  We both rip at 128 kbps AAC since we find that bit rate suitable for our ears and we both have iPods to play the AAC files on.  But back on topic, I would say that if you used 192kbps-256kbps with the iTunes MP3 encoder that you should get pretty decent results.  Just do some listening tests of your own and decide what iTunes MP3 encoder bit rate satisfies your ears.  As far as iTunes MP3 encoder's VBR goes, I wasn't impressed by it.  It has you choose a min bit rate and a max bit rate.  The problem is that it does not encode silence at 32kbps like LAME does, it encodes it at the min bit rate.  And if you set the min bit rate too low, the audio quality suffers greatly.  It's a wierd VBR system that the iTunes MP3 encoder uses so I personally recommend using CBR with the iTunes MP3 encoder to get the best quality the encoder can put out.

When does iTunes MP3 = Lame Mp3

Reply #4 –
Do you absolutely need to use MP3? If AAC is acceptable, you'll have easy access to one of the best AAC encoders in iTunes/Quicktime.

When does iTunes MP3 = Lame Mp3

Reply #5 –
You did not really mentionned if you were considering ITunes to encode in mp3 or aac.
 

When does iTunes MP3 = Lame Mp3

Reply #6 –
For your girlfriend I would recommend:
- 128 AAC or
- 160 MP3 VBR at highest quality setting

I did some testing of iTunes 4.6 comparings different bitrates between ACC vs. MP3 VBR vs. LAME.

In general I had a hard time telling the samples apart on an ABC/HR test I did on the iPod, except for samples made with iTunes MP3 VBR with 112/128 kbps as lowest bitrate.

Code: [Select]
"128" listening tests compiled results:
                         A=iTunes 4.2 m4p 128
                                B=iTunes 4.6 aac 128
                                       C=iTunes 4.6 aac 160
                                              D=iTunes 4.6 mp3 112 vbr
                                                     E=iTunes 4.6 mp3 128 vbr
                                       lame 3.96 mp3 128 v5=F
                         A      B      C      D      E      F
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
           BigYellow     -     4.9    5.0    5.0    5.0    5.0
                Echo    3.4    5.0    4.2    3.0    4.6    4.6
                Gone     -     4.8    5.0    5.0    4.9    5.0
           Hungarian     -     5.0    5.0    5.0    5.0    5.0
      ItCouldBeSweet     -     5.0    5.0    4.8    4.8    4.8
           Kraftwerk     -     4.9    5.0    4.9    5.0    5.0
       OrdinaryWorld     -     5.0    5.0    5.0    5.0    4.5
            RedHouse     -     5.0    5.0    4.5    4.8    4.9
            Rosemary     -     5.0    5.0    5.0    5.0    5.0
              School    5.0    4.5    4.7    4.8    4.8    4.8
            Stairway     -     4.6    5.0    5.0    3.8    5.0
             Waiting     -     5.0    5.0    4.5    4.8    5.0
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
             AVERAGE    4.20   4.89   4.91   4.71   4.79   4.88
===============================================================================
Prepared 2004-08-15 21:31 with iPod-ABX v0.4
Performed 2004-07-27 on iPod with Sennheiser PXC-250 head phones


However that is my personal results and if you want to do a listening test, you might get a different result.

iPod-ABX

When does iTunes MP3 = Lame Mp3

Reply #7 –
Quote
You did not really mentionned if you were considering ITunes to encode in mp3 or aac.
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=253304"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Well, the thread title says iTunes MP3. 

Anyway, if you must stick with iTunes for encoding, I really encourage you to consider AAC.

When does iTunes MP3 = Lame Mp3

Reply #8 –
Thanks for the responses. I'd prefer to stick with MP3 for maximum compatibility. I did some quick tests using 256VBR and the quality seems to be equivalent, so I'll use that.

Cheers

Steve

When does iTunes MP3 = Lame Mp3

Reply #9 –
doh!

When does iTunes MP3 = Lame Mp3

Reply #10 –
I read somewhere there's a way to use LAME from within iTunes, perhaps that would solve the problem.

When does iTunes MP3 = Lame Mp3

Reply #12 –
To my ears... using Shostakovich's "Galop from Ballet Suite No.2" I find that using Itunes MP3 importing with the below customs settings are undistinguishable from Lame -preset standard:

Itunes Settings -
192 VBR
Highest Quality
Auto Sample
Auto Stereo
Joint Stereo
Smart Encoding Enabled
Fillter -10Hz Freq Enabled


The speed, convenience, and quality switched me from EAC+Lame to using Itunes, except with some badly scratched CDs which really need EAC to save them.

_________________
~~~Sylvangale~~~

When does iTunes MP3 = Lame Mp3

Reply #13 –
You can also choose Error Correction when importing which may make things closer to EAC.

Interestingly, I checked some iTunes MP3s with Encspot. While most it listed the encoder as FHG (Fastenc), for quite a few tracks the encoder was listed as 'lame (old)'.

I assume this is just a glitch with Encspot?

Cheers

Steve

When does iTunes MP3 = Lame Mp3

Reply #14 –
Quote
To my ears... using Shostakovich's "Galop from Ballet Suite No.2" I find that using Itunes MP3 importing with the below customs settings are undistinguishable from Lame -preset standard:

Itunes Settings -
192 VBR
Highest Quality
Auto Sample
Auto Stereo
Joint Stereo
Smart Encoding Enabled
Fillter -10Hz Freq Enabled




_________________
~~~Sylvangale~~~
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=253683"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


Just note that enabling Smart Encoding in Itunes will disable joint stereo (if you're using 192 as your base bitrate - doesn't disable it at lower bitrates).  I'm not making any comment on quality here, just that the resulting MP3 will be using Stereo.

When does iTunes MP3 = Lame Mp3

Reply #15 –
Quote
Just note that enabling Smart Encoding in Itunes will disable joint stereo (if you're using 192 as your base bitrate - doesn't disable it at lower bitrates).  I'm not making any comment on quality here, just that the resulting MP3 will be using Stereo.
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=254380"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


iTunes is really not that good on joint stereo, so quality-wise it's a good thing it's disabled at >192kbps..

When does iTunes MP3 = Lame Mp3

Reply #16 –
Quote
iTunes is really not that good on joint stereo, so quality-wise it's a good thing it's disabled at >192kbps..
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=254385"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


Agreed.  Newcomers to HA will quickly get a sense of the pro-joint-stereo sentiment here, but need to realize it only applies to MP3 encoders that actually do joint stereo well . . . such as LAME.