Skip to main content ↑ ↓

Notice

Please note that most of the software linked on this forum is likely to be safe to use. If you are unsure, feel free to ask in the relevant topics, or send a private message to an administrator or moderator. To help curb the problems of false positives, or in the event that you do find actual malware, you can contribute through the article linked here.
Topic: Can lossy tracks appear lossless in Spectral Analysis? (Read 4697 times) previous topic - next topic
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Can lossy tracks appear lossless in Spectral Analysis?

As the title asks, is it possible for a lossy encoded music track - ogg vorbis in this case - to appear lossless in Spectral Analysis?

Can lossy tracks appear lossless in Spectral Analysis?

Reply #1 –
I think so.
Try encoding to -q 10 and looking at the spectral analysis.

Moderation: Removed useless full quote of previous post.  The first post, nonetheless.

Can lossy tracks appear lossless in Spectral Analysis?

Reply #2 –
If you're just asking for "can": 100% Yes.

Can lossy tracks appear lossless in Spectral Analysis?

Reply #3 –
Thanks for the info. I was just curious as I ripped a CD to .ogg a couple of years ago (before I became an audiophile) and I played it back in AA with the spectral analysis window open. I thought it quite strange that it looked lossless.

Why does it show up like this?

Can lossy tracks appear lossless in Spectral Analysis?

Reply #5 –
NOTE - I don't understand all of the details behind OGG.  I know that MP3 tends to filter-out the highest frequencies, but this isn't required for lossy compression.  If you have simple sine waves (unlike real music) it doesn't require any more "information" to reproduce a 20kHz sine wave than it does to reproduce a 1kHz sine wave.  Both of these can be compressed equally.  (i.e. It's just as easy to say "play a 20kHz wave for 1 second" as it is to say "play a 1kHz wave for 1 second".)

The whole idea behind (high fidelity) lossless compression is to preserve the original sound so that it sounds exactly like the original.    If the compressed copy sounds like the original, I would expect the spectrum to look similar to the original. 

If you "zoom-in" and look carefully at the details, you might see a difference, and if you were to study the underlying spectral data, you would likely find differences between the original spectral content and the compressed spectral content.

Quote
(before I became an audiophile)
  You might not want to admit that!      By the traditional-dictionary definition, I think many of us are true audiophiles...  We are lovers of good audio!  But, there is a lot of nonsense associated with the audiophile community and "audiophiles" (or audiofools) seem to have a bad reputation around here!  (This reputation mostly comes from wild claims that can't be backed-up with blind testing.)

Can lossy tracks appear lossless in Spectral Analysis?

Reply #6 –
Quote from: DVDdoug on
If you "zoom-in" and look carefully at the details, you might see a difference, and if you were to study the underlying spectral data, you would likely find differences between the original spectral content and the compressed spectral content.


If you have the lossless source still at hand it's quite easy to see a difference. But if the lossless source is not at hand it's close to impossible. You could compare it to the AccurateRip database, though, using CueTools.
 

Can lossy tracks appear lossless in Spectral Analysis?

Reply #7 –
Quote from: DVDdoug on
By the traditional-dictionary definition, I think many of us are true audiophiles...  We are lovers of good audio!  But, there is a lot of nonsense associated with the audiophile community and "audiophiles" (or audiofools) seem to have a bad reputation around here!  (This reputation mostly comes from wild claims that can't be backed-up with blind testing.)
Audiofools are the natural prey of Fraudiophiles.