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Topic: CD to lossless to lossy workflow on Mac (Read 4873 times) previous topic - next topic
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CD to lossless to lossy workflow on Mac

Hi, I'm pretty new to audio archiving and I've only started reading these forums last weekend.  I hope that this is the correct forum for this topic as it isn't about a specific format, hardware, or anything technical.  I apologize in advance for the wall of text.

I want to archive my CD collection (about 1000 discs) with the following parameters:
  • lossless format for the archive
  • automated metadata/tag/album-art
  • metadata/tags/album-art/whatever about the files stored with the files
  • automated generation of MP3s from the archive for streaming and DAP use
  • ideally, the MP3s are automatically added to my iTunes library
  • ability to recreate the CD from the archive copy
My setup:
  • Macbook Pro (15" 2.2ghz core2duo)
  • External disk, for ripping/encoding workspace (Lacie something or other, using firewire400)
  • NAS, for archival storage (Qnap TS-109 PRO II with a 1TB drive)
So, with that out of the way...  I've decided to go with XLD for a CD -> FLAC -> MP3 workflow.

Max isn't too bad.  The UI is a bit wonky, but it works.  The script to get metadata from iTunes is useful because I've found Musicbrainz to be somewhat lacking with my collection.  However I found that the ripping and encoding was slow when using cdparanoia mode and if you produce one flac per track and you want a cue file, it produces one cue file per track (I might have it setup incorrectly).

XLD is better than Max.  I use the GUI version of XLD because I can't figure out how to rip a disk from the command line (haven't really tried very hard though  ).  Cleaner interface, cdparanoia III support, logfile generation, cue file generation, freedb and musicbrainz support, it's quite fast on a multi-core machine, AND it can simultaneously encode FLAC and MP3 and put the MP3s right into an iTunes library.  I think that it meets almost all of my requirements.

I've got nothing against iTunes for a CD -> ALAC -> AAC/MP3 workflow.  ALAC looks like a good format and I use many Apple products, but I'm mostly worried about iTunes' potential technical limitations.  As far as I can tell iTunes doesn't rip with the accuracy of the cdparanoia library and I'm not sure if it's possible to recreate the original CD from the ALAC files - I know that it's possible to recreate the original waveform, but I'm not sure about the CD layout. FLAC + cue file apparently supports this. 

Now, for a few newb questions:

The ability to recreate the original CD from the archive is important to me, and the ability to create an MP3 (or other format), from the archived copy, for each track is also important to me.  Should I use one flac file + cue file, or many flac files + cue file, or simply many flac files with embedded cue information?

Is there some sort of conventions for naming and organizing the archive files?  I mean, I can store the archive in a single directory with all of the files named "[artist] - [album] -
  • [track]", or I can organize by folders "[Artist]/[Album]/
  • [track]"and I'm trying to figure out what would be simplest to manage in the future.

    Both of these things seem to be matters of personal preference, but I want to do it the best possible way right from the start.

    Thanks in advance for any help.

CD to lossless to lossy workflow on Mac

Reply #1 –
NOTE - I'm not a MAC user.

Quote
The ability to recreate the original CD from the archive is important to me, and the ability to create an MP3 (or other format), from the archived copy, for each track is also important to me. Should I use one flac file + cue file, or many flac files + cue file, or simply many flac files with embedded cue information?
Since you're making individual MP3s, I think it will be easier to with individual FLACs.  This will also allow you to directly play your FLAC tracks, if you ever decide to go that route.

When I'm simply copying a CD I'll usually make a single (WAV) file, but I've done it both ways.

Quote
Is there some sort of conventions for naming and organizing the archive files? I mean, I can store the archive in a single directory with all of the files named "[artist] - [album] -
  • [track]", or I can organize by folders "[Artist]/[Album]/
  • [track]"and I'm trying to figure out what would be simplest to manage in the future.
You're right... It's a matter of personal preference.  Your player software can usually organize itself from the tag information, no matter how you physically organize the files. 

I think most people make a multi-level directory "structure", something like: "[Artist]/[Album]/
  • [track]".  I have an additional "top" folder for category/genre.  About 95% of my music is lumped in a folder called "Rock & Popular", but I also have separate folders for Soundtracks, Various Artist, Christmas, Halloween, Mexican, and some other "special" categories.

    For "various artists" CDs, I don't make a folder for each artist.  I make a folder for the CD, and then I just include the artist name in the filename.

    I don't include the track number as part of the file name unless it's a soundtrack, live performance, etc., where the sequence is more important than usual.

CD to lossless to lossy workflow on Mac

Reply #2 –
That's easy. Use XLD to rip everything to ALAC and let it add pregaps to the former track. Use auto import to iTunes. That's your lossless library. Now close iTunes and and open it again by "alt"-clicking its program symbol. iTunes will ask you to create a new library or chose one. Create one in a different folder, it's going to be your lossy library. Now change XLD's options to output highest quality true VBR AAC (~192 kbit). Again set it to auto import to iTunes. Now drop your lossless library's root folder on the XLD symbol. When it's done you'll have what you were looking for. You can alternate between both libraries by "alt"-clicking the iTunes symbols at startup.

CD to lossless to lossy workflow on Mac

Reply #4 –
As far as recreating a CD is concerned, if you're really, really picky you should bear in the mind the necessity of compensating for your drive's write offset. If you know this value I suppose you could rip with a combined read/write offset but that would limit you to that particular drive in the future. Your other alternative (other than booting into Windows) would be to use something like mktoc to convert your (expanded) WAVs to offset-corrected ones.

CD to lossless to lossy workflow on Mac

Reply #5 –
Quote from: ffooky on
As far as recreating a CD is concerned, if you're really, really picky you should bear in the mind the necessity of compensating for your drive's write offset.


XLD does that automatically and knows most Mac drives already. Recreating original CDs is possible right from iTunes by selecting the tracks and burning them without additional pauses. The burned CDs will be recognized by AccurateRip as accurately ripped. If you want to include INDEX00 gaps (has anybody ever found a good reason for their existence anyway?), you additionally need to preserve cue sheets at ripping time.

CD to lossless to lossy workflow on Mac

Reply #6 –
Quote from: rpp3po on
XLD does that automatically and knows most Mac drives already.
Nope, it detects the read offset.

Quote
Recreating original CDs is possible right from iTunes by selecting the tracks and burning them without additional pauses.
Even ignoring the other ways in which this would not be an exact copy of the original, you'd still not be compensating for your drive's write offset.

CD to lossless to lossy workflow on Mac

Reply #7 –
Quote from: ffooky on
Quote from: rpp3po on
XLD does that automatically and knows most Mac drives already.
Nope, it detects the read offset.
Quote
Recreating original CDs is possible right from iTunes by selecting the tracks and burning them without additional pauses.
Even ignoring the other ways in which this would not be an exact copy of the original, you'd still not be compensating for your drive's write offset.


Oh, I overread that. Yes it detects the read offset. I never understood why people care about this, anyway. It is neither relevant for FreeDB, Gracenote, etc. nor for AccurateRip if proper implemented. The only difference in practice is the difference, wether the player starts playing the first track 11ms after I click play or 11.5 ms. Who would care about that?
 

CD to lossless to lossy workflow on Mac

Reply #9 –
Wow... thanks for all of the responses folks.  I really appreciate it.

I'm definitely going to experiment with the CD -> ALAC + CD -> MP3 route and use two separate iTunes libraries.  I'm not too concerned with 100% perfect CD reproduction; passing the accuraterip test is probably good enough.  If iTunes can do it with ALAC files then... yay.  It seems like simple and sufficient workflow and management strategy.