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Topic: Ripping CDs for archive and daily use - recommended ways (Read 4035 times) previous topic - next topic
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Ripping CDs for archive and daily use - recommended ways

I was hoping to get some pointers from all of you experts.    I know posts like this can be boring, but I'm hoping it will be useful for others too, and I couldn't find anything straightforward already posted despite a few days' Googling.

Anyway, I would very much appreciate some guidance on how best to rip my CD collection. I had made a start, but then committed the fatal (to a perfectionist) error of re-checking some of my decisions on forums etc., and have just confused myself again.

The set-up I'd like, and had started to create:

* Ripping just once. In common with lots of others, I only want to do the ripping once (it takes ages as I only have one PC and need to leave CDs to rip overnight so I don't try to overload the processor doing other things at the same time like checking e-mail and web surfing). I'd like not to invest a lot of time in a substandard job that I'll not be satisfied with afterwards because I later find that I could have done a better job with my current equipment.

* Archive and daily use copies, with art and tags. I had started to rip my CDs to my ext. HD in FLAC lossless format using EAC (v0.99). This was to create an archive copy (see my background note on kit and software below). Mostly this was going okay and I've done ten or so, but a few discs had errors and seemed to get "stuck" such that I wasn't sure if EAC was "fixing" them or was just sticking.

I then wanted to tag the files up and attach art. Then create an mp3 file copy, which would be for general use (again, pls see my background note on kit and software below -- also, for my classical CDs, I was going to go straight to rip into MP3 from the CD.)

Then a final tagging round to add anything to the mp3 file that couldn't be tagged on the FLAC file (if there is anything to add -- I'm not 100% sure of my knowledge of the various tagging capabilities of the different file formats).

(Finally, in common with the rest of my documents/files, I was backing up my portable ext HD to the static ext. HD, just for security's sake. Of course, when I've finished, there'll also be copies of many of my mp3 files on my portable music device.)   

The questions I had and that I couldn't find ready answers to:

I'm pretty confident that I've chosen decent formats for the archive and daily use (flac for lossless because its well regarded; mp3 for daily use because it is very flexible in terms of compatibility). ls there any reason why I shouldn't have decided to go down this path?

Should I be creating individual flac files for each track? I've seen lots of recommendations for creating single Flac "images" of CDs, with a cue sheet, but I don't really understand what all that's about. Is that something I should be considering for my lossless archive copies and, if so, how do I go about setting that up? Are their compatibility issues in terms of going on to create mp3 copies?

What is good software to use for encoding? I had been using EAC (see background notes on my software below) but don't fully understand it, and have since found posts (e.g. http://flac.sourceforge.net/faq.html#tools__eac_and_flac) recommending software that might makes things easier for me, like AutoFLAC. Is AutoFLAC worth using? Better than Omni Encoder and MAREO? Does anyone have a process for achieving a similar outcome to what I'm looking for that they would recommend?

Do I need to worry about tagging (I've read about different versions of tags for mp3s) or, if I'm using Media Monkey to build and maintain my library, can I rely on that application to do the essentials for me to make my tags platform-proof as long as I make sure I've set the "track properties" to how I want them?

Finally, is album art only ever downloaded from the web? I seem to recall from a previous ripping project that on some CDs came with the art installed as files? Is that true and, if so, how do you get at it?

Background on my current set-up is below (I know it often helps in terms of giving useful answers). I'm computer literate, but a bit of a novice for this type of stuff. So I can cope with most things as long as it's explained in a not too technical way. Am more than happy to be referred to other threads / webpages if you think they contain the answers I'm looking for. Am just grateful for any support this forum can give
me. Apologies for the length of the post, but I hope others will also find it useful.

Many thanks

My collection: Not huge (c. 100 discs) but a mix of pop and classical. Would like to create lossless copies of my pop CDs so I can pack them away (and will probably move to buying that music in the future mostly through downloads). Am considering keeping out my classical CDs as I tend to listen to them specifically (not as background on my iPod while walking around). Also, I imagine that they take up more storage room in a lossless format than a typical pop album would?

My kit: Windows XP laptop; External hard drive (which I want to store the archive CD copies on); Portable external hard drive (which I want to store "daily use" (lossy) copies of all my music on for loading on and off music devices.

My software: MediaMonkey for play back and library, and I found tagging straightforward on that too (is there any reason not to use MM?). Had downloaded, and was using, EAC for ripping till I started questioning if I was doing the right thing and finding more "front-end" applications online that looked like they might make things easier for me). I also installed Mp3tag for tagging (read that it was useful) but couldn't see what it gave me over tagging using MediaMonkey - have I missed something major?)

Ripping CDs for archive and daily use - recommended ways

Reply #1 –
I don't know why you did not receive several comments on your questions which I thought were excellent.

I'll try to help.

Quote from: gebaxter on
I'm pretty confident that I've chosen decent formats for the archive and daily use (flac for lossless because its well regarded; mp3 for daily use because it is very flexible in terms of compatibility). ls there any reason why I shouldn't have decided to go down this path?


I use FLAC for virtually all playback and MP3 only when FLAC is not a choice (in the car or with iPod).

Quote from: gebaxter on
Should I be creating individual flac files for each track? I've seen lots of recommendations for creating single Flac "images" of CDs, with a cue sheet, but I don't really understand what all that's about. Is that something I should be considering for my lossless archive copies and, if so, how do I go about setting that up? Are their compatibility issues in terms of going on to create mp3 copies?


I rip individual tracks.  It just seems easier because any audio playback program can handle the data. 

Quote from: gebaxter on
What is good software to use for encoding? I had been using EAC


I use EAC.  Many people also like db Poweramp.  EAC is free.  Either will require a bit of set up for best results.  There are many good tutorials on the web.

Quote from: gebaxter on
. . . software that might makes things easier for me, like AutoFLAC. Is AutoFLAC worth using?


AutoFLAC makes ripping easier by configuring EAC with rip preferences, but it too needs a bit of set up by the end user.  Be careful in how you set up the rip path (it must match the path set in EAC).  If I remember correctly,  the readme has some inaccurate information.    Additionally, its write function offers an easy way to burn a disc which is a duplicate of the original CD.


Quote from: gebaxter on
.Do I need to worry about tagging?


There are many, many answers to tagging including not tagging at all.  It's a choice contingent upon individual preference.  I use MP3tag, another free program that works very well.


Quote from: gebaxter on
Finally, is album art only ever downloaded from the web?


Many audio playback programs do this for you.  I cannot add additional clarification as for me it's not really a priority


Hopefully, you have already found the answer to many of these questions but if not, try posting again for better clarification

Ripping CDs for archive and daily use - recommended ways

Reply #2 –
Not all EAC tutorials are correct and up to date. Use this.

Ripping CDs for archive and daily use - recommended ways

Reply #3 –
Quote from: gebaxter on
Am considering keeping out my classical CDs as I tend to listen to them specifically (not as background on my iPod while walking around). Also, I imagine that they take up more storage room in a lossless format than a typical pop album would?

It's [almost always] the other way round - it has nothing to do with the "refinement" of the music. For example losslessly encoded white noise takes up more space than Pop or Classical music.

C.
PC = TAK + LossyWAV  ::  Portable = Opus (130)

Ripping CDs for archive and daily use - recommended ways

Reply #4 –
Warning - I am far from an expert, but I've embarked on a very similar process to you and may be able to add a couple of points.  Firstly, it seems that CUE sheets are like a map of the CD, detailing among other things how the tracks are laid out on the CD. I think this map has info such as the gaps between tracks. This is useful if you intend to use your archive to recreate the CD at some point. E.g. It would be useful in the case of a mixed dance CD which should not have gaps between the tracks. I'm not sure if there is any use for a cue sheet if you don't intend to recreate the CD. I assume that the single file FLAC is also more useful for CD recreation than for creating a media library.

As for tagging, I'd just like to put in a mention for MusicBrainz, which is a database of CDs that can be used as a source of tag data much like freedb. I've become quite a big fan of MB because of its cleanliness and its strict style guide rules - handy for ensuring that all entries stick to the same format (e.g. in MB's world, classical CDs are always attributed to the composer and not the performer - the performer is added to the end of the release title instead). You can adjust EAC to pull data from MB instead of freedb (see instructions).  Unfortunately, EAC doesn't handle this data perfectly, so I sometimes also use MusicBrainz own tagger PicardTagger but I also like MP3tag because it's reliable and I've got it configured exactly how I want it.

Finally, I do all this on my Dell Dimension, which has a reasonable spec since it's only 1.5 yrs old. It takes me about 10 mins to rip a CD in one of my drives.  The other drive can handle scratches better, but is much slower.  With 100 CD, that's 100 days at 1 CD per night - could it be worth considering what's slowing your rip down? - it may be your CD drive and you may be able to buy one that would do the job much quicker - but I'm well out of my depth here.

BTW - I have no affiliation to MusicBrainz.

Ripping CDs for archive and daily use - recommended ways

Reply #5 –
Quote from: gebaxter on
I'm pretty confident that I've chosen decent formats for the archive and daily use (flac for lossless because its well regarded; mp3 for daily use because it is very flexible in terms of compatibility). ls there any reason why I shouldn't have decided to go down this path?

The formats that you have chosen for the specific purposes are perfect. Should you later decide to switch formats, you can do so easily using your FLAC copies. And for the record, I use FLAC for archives and MP3s for daily usage as well.

Quote from: gebaxter on
Should I be creating individual flac files for each track? I've seen lots of recommendations for creating single Flac "images" of CDs, with a cue sheet, but I don't really understand what all that's about. Is that something I should be considering for my lossless archive copies and, if so, how do I go about setting that up? Are their compatibility issues in terms of going on to create mp3 copies?

I like the "one track per disc" a.k.a "image" creation method. I can split the single FLAC image to multiple FLAC files easily using FB2K, CueProc or any such software. I don't know if going the other way around is (a) possible, (b) easy and © accurate - which means that I don't end up modifying/losing any information. All of these three points may not be a big deal after all. I haven't done much reading about that. But what I do know is that going from an image to multiple tracks is quite easy and straight-forward.

Ripping CDs for archive and daily use - recommended ways

Reply #6 –
Yes, it is (a) possible and © accurate.  It is not as (b) easy (when gaps are appended to the previous track).  If your drive is not capable of extracting HTOA(*), there is no HTOA or the HTOA is not worth extracting, then it (d) does not make any difference.

I wish people would stop (e) spreading misinformation on the subject.

(*) In some cases ripping as a single-file image isn't even possible:
http://www.digital-inn.de/exact-audio-copy...ther-stuff.html

My recommendation is to rip as separate tracks.

Ripping CDs for archive and daily use - recommended ways

Reply #7 –
First of all, this newbie would like to thank HA and all of the contributors for providing the best source of audio information on the planet.  I would particularly like to THANK the more experienced members that find the time to help those of us that are at the lower end of the learning curve.  Yes, most of the basic information is here if you look for it.  And yes it’s expected (at least for me) that you do a little homework (as gebaxter did).  But a confirmation or redirection from the experience folks goes a long way.  Thanks for taking the time to help.  IT’S APPRECIATED!

gebaxter,

I think we are in similar a situation.  We want our collection (I have 340 CDs) secured (archived) and good listening experience to the output of our choice.  Here’s my plan / thoughts so far:

Archive:
FLAC
Using: EAC -> FLAC

HiFi:
FLAC and/or MP3 (Lame –V3)
*Using: Foobar2000 converter (FLAC -> LAME MP3)

Portable Players:
MP3 (Lame –V?)
*Using: Foobar2000 converter (FLAC -> LAME MP3)

PC Media Player / Manager:
TDB:  WINAMP WMP, FOOBAR, Teen Spirit …?  The album library (database) with art is important to me as well as the organization features.  One opinion on player/organizers is here.

My Experience:
I have ripped a lot of CDs using EAC –> LAME MP3 (Probably overkill) for my portable and it was easy with no problems.  * I haven’t tried any of the conversion software yet.  Foobar2000 is what I’m going to look at first.  I am currently using Windows Media Player 11 because it was there and haven’t spent the effort to go elsewhere.  That’s changed.

Next for me:
•   Start archiving Cds: EAC -> FLAC
•   **After I get a dozen CDs to FLAC I’ll trial conversion software (FLAC -> MP3) starting with Foobar2000.
•   **After I get a dozen CDs to FLAC and MP3 look at PC Media Player / Manager options.
**  With only a few CDs processed I think this is the best time to experiment/trial these.

Good luck on your project.  Post or sent me a note on how you are doing,

SaltyDog