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Topic: Advantage of NCQ in HDDs (Read 5881 times) previous topic - next topic
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Advantage of NCQ in HDDs

Hey folks, my four years old PC came with a 250 GB HDD that has less and less free space ever since I started ripping CDs to FLAC. I was looking for a new HDD the other day and was wondering what to get, especially since I am planing to build my own PC this year. The computer I use now does not offer a SATA controller, but getting a new IDE drive would be wasted money IMO. That's why I wanted to get a SATA II disk together with a cheap SATA controller. I know that cheap controllers connected over the PCI bus are not going to be very fast, but at the moment, I am only looking for storage. However, when I start to build my PC, I would like to use the new HDD I am buying as primary storage device, so the drive itself should be reliable and fast.

Anyways, I saw that SATA II drives come in two "flavors": with and without NCQ. I know that the idea is to cache operations and optimize the way data is accessed instead of reading and writing back and forth. But does that really work? I mean, is there really a significant difference between NCQ and non-NCQ drives of the same generation?

Advantage of NCQ in HDDs

Reply #1 –
NCQ helps when you're doing many disk intensive operations simultaneously. Like copying/unzipping and video encoding. All NCQ drives allow you to use them without NCQ so buying NCQ is a safe bet if the price difference is insignifficant.

Advantage of NCQ in HDDs

Reply #2 –
And when it comes to speed on current setup - if you have one IDE channel to sacrifice, you could use an adapter that plugs into IDE port in the motherboard and gives you one SATA channel (they use bridge chips, like the first SATA drives which weren't really SATA or adapters which allow you to connect IDE devices to SATA - only in this case in reverse)
You'd get basically native speeds and no potential mess with drivers of PCI controller.

Advantage of NCQ in HDDs

Reply #3 –
NCQ comes from the SCSI world. Therefore, it is very much elite. Enough said.

Advantage of NCQ in HDDs

Reply #4 –
I don't know if the IDE solution zima proposed is worth it, but word of advice, by all means avoid PCI-SATA adapters. Even though storage is your only concern, their speeds are ridiculous, and will eventually frustrate you. I bought one (SATA2 with NCQ and open source drivers), wasn't even that cheap, and its performance was awful. End up selling it for like €10...

Yeah, terrible deal... I still regret it.

Advantage of NCQ in HDDs

Reply #6 –
My Asus board has only one P-ATA IDE channel for two devices and I need it for my optical drives. I recently bought this Samsung HDD and I'm quite satisfied with it.

Advantage of NCQ in HDDs

Reply #7 –
Well, I will only use my Plextor PX-230A on the PATA channel, so I can use one additional device like a HDD. I will most likely get a SATA DVD burner once I set up my PC, although I read that the write quality isn't as good with modern SATA burners (at least according to c't).
 

Advantage of NCQ in HDDs

Reply #8 –
definitely get SATA 3Gb/sec. There is a very noticeable speed boost over ATA100 or even SATA150.  Most mobos support it as it is the standard right now.  A larger cashe also helps.
It's due for a good DEGAUSSIN'

Advantage of NCQ in HDDs

Reply #9 –
Bleh, seems that some of you didn't read my post entirely.

My current motherboard does not support SATA - it only has two PATA channels. After I am done with moving, I plan to build a new PC that will support SATA.

My options at the moment are:
  • Get a SATA HDD and a SATA controller (PCI card) so I can use the HDD in my current PC --> emtee said that the speed would be very low
  • Get an IDE HDD to use in both PCs since even new motherboards have a PATA controller --> how fast are PATA controllers on new motherboards - faster than a PCI SATA controller?

Advantage of NCQ in HDDs

Reply #10 –
How much money would you like to spent for a SATA IDE card? If it will cost you more than a quarter of a new HDD, then--imho--don't go the PCI SATA controller route, it will be a waste of money.

Advantage of NCQ in HDDs

Reply #12 –
Quote from: Sebastian Mares on
Yeah, you're probably right. Thought I will sell it (the SATA controller) together with my old PC, but I doubt I will get the money back.

I agree. And just so you won't feel so bad buying a "deprecated" technology such as P-ATA, there are no noticeable differences performance-wise between SATA (1.5 or 3) and P-ATA drives. The interface isn't really the bottleneck. Sure, SATA is cleaner and there is no master/slave/cableselect jumper nonsense, but apart from that, I believe you won't be able to tell the difference between SATA and PATA.

Advantage of NCQ in HDDs

Reply #13 –
Just my 2 cent: The cheapest SATA-controller I've seen costs less than 20€. You might as well ask yourself whether you are willing to pay this for a temporal solution.

Advantage of NCQ in HDDs

Reply #15 –
Quote from: emtee on
I don't know if the IDE solution zima proposed is worth it, but word of advice, by all means avoid PCI-SATA adapters. Even though storage is your only concern, their speeds are ridiculous, and will eventually frustrate you.


That sounds very strange. If the PCI SATA adapter uses the same chipset as an onboard adapter (say, SiliconImage), their speed should be pretty much the same given the motherboard chipset also connects to the south bridge through PCI (in the PCI world, that is called a planar device).

Same thing would apply to a PCIe SATA II onboard chipset (say, Marvell) vs. PCIe SATA II adapter card with same chipset.

Advantage of NCQ in HDDs

Reply #16 –
Quote from: rjamorim on
Quote from: emtee on
I don't know if the IDE solution zima proposed is worth it, but word of advice, by all means avoid PCI-SATA adapters. Even though storage is your only concern, their speeds are ridiculous, and will eventually frustrate you.


That sounds very strange. If the PCI SATA adapter uses the same chipset as an onboard adapter (say, SiliconImage), their speed should be pretty much the same given the motherboard chipset also connects to the south bridge through PCI (in the PCI world, that is called a planar device).

Same thing would apply to a PCIe SATA II onboard chipset (say, Marvell) vs. PCIe SATA II adapter card with same chipset.

He may just have made ONE bad experience with a PCI-SATA controller, and extrapolating it to ALL PCI-SATA controllers (thats called a prejudice by hasty generalization). Though, without further info, there is no way to know how he came to this conclusion.
I am arrogant and I can afford it because I deliver.

Advantage of NCQ in HDDs

Reply #17 –
God dammit! The Seagate drive is again out of stock and the guys have no idea when Seagate is shipping new ones. Now I can either have my money back, order another drive or wait a few days / weeks. Samsung would be an alternative because the price is similar, but I had bad experience with Samsung drives (a friend and I bought the same model and both drives died at almost the same time - mine had lots of bad blocks and his had a head-crash).

Advantage of NCQ in HDDs

Reply #18 –
Does anyone know how Hitachi Deathstar Deskstar drives are nowadays?

Edit: Forget about it, has only 8 MB buffer and the Seagate seems to be deliverable in 3 to 5 days.