Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

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Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

2005-12-07 14:17:09

I'm wanting to purchase a portable MP3 player. The most important thing about it, which is going to make the sale, is audio quality - I want it to sound as good as possible for a portable device (both in terms of the mp3 decoding quality, and the audio chip itself?)

Not as important, but: I'd also like things such as reasonable storage (20G plus, more the better), OGG (possible FLAC) support, a UI that isn't slow and doesn't suck, and possible high quality audio recording via internal mic/line-in suitable for sampling random noises, but audio quality is really the big thing.

I'm planning on mostly using a pair of Sennheiser HD-280 headphones with it and various earphones, but also running it back into a mixer or two hooked up to monitors.

The iAudio X5L looks the most tempting so far, but I'm looking for people who have truly compared it against other offerings. I can be tempted into buying an iPod, but have heard that the 3rd/4th/5th generation iPods have much crappier sound than the earlier generations due to a different (not as good) audio chip being used or something?

I tried an iRiver H10 for a little while but really wasn't all that impressed with it - I'd prefer not to use an equaliser if possible (I like my music reproduced accurately), but found I had to use it extensively to get decent sound out of it. Is the H320 any better in terms of audio quality?

Advice appreciated.

Thanks.

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #1 – 2005-12-07 15:14:17

Quote

I can be tempted into buying an iPod, but have heard that the 3rd/4th/5th generation iPods have much crappier sound than the earlier generations due to a different (not as good) audio chip being used or something?
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=348319"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

The 5G's are considered the best so far, but I really believe most people have complained about quality on DAP's because of crappy headphones, unwise encoder settings, and even placebo, rather than the audio chip.

YMMV...

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #2 – 2005-12-07 15:42:41

I've been reading buzz on various blogs that the new Kenwood MP3 players are the best when it comes to audio quality. Otherwise, I've found that Creative's players work very well for me - their extensive experience with audio cards definitely shows.

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #3 – 2005-12-07 16:07:55

Quote

Quote
I can be tempted into buying an iPod, but have heard that the 3rd/4th/5th generation iPods have much crappier sound than the earlier generations due to a different (not as good) audio chip being used or something?
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=348319"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

The 5G's are considered the best so far, but I really believe most people have complained about quality on DAP's because of crappy headphones, unwise encoder settings, and even placebo, rather than the audio chip.

YMMV...
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=348329"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I gotta 2nd the 5g ipod. I've been really nit-picky w/ DAPs, I've gone through about 10-12 in the past 5 years & this so far is the ONLY one I've enjoyed using & been happy with. This is my first ipod- 1g-4g I never bought because I thought they sucked.

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #4 – 2005-12-07 17:04:33

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...their extensive experience with audio cards definitely shows.

You must be joking! Just search here at HA for Creative and you'll see!
Don't get me wrong, they are experienced in making audio HW but they are definitely not considered as the audio HW leader!

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #5 – 2005-12-07 17:22:04

For what it's worth, I'm a Rio Karma owner ( a happy one ) but they've left the audio small player business as it seems so I wouldn't look at their products very much.

What I really think is that you should take certain things into account before deciding.

Many here seems to be iPod owners, and it seems to be one of those items everyone "must have". However, I still haven't heard something reasonably good to why? most use the term "It's cool" and then you ask them, whatabout quality, and they go something about 70% market share... must be good... and the whole thing behind it is basically that they would never wanna admit they've made a bad decision in terms of value for money OR best quality (being different is painful I guess). Please take this into account when reading comments here, and _especially_ iPod ones.

Please also note things such as OGG or FLAC obviously was forgotten when they read what you'd wish for beyond quality issues (as if that isn't quality if something)

As far as I'm concerned, the iAudio X5 seems to the best choice on the market for now quality wise. Locally here they are quite rare, and I haven't actually used it to be able to give a good view on the software side (computer issues) about it. However, from the specs I've seen it seems to be the best of the best for now.

Why is iAudio brilliant?
- Audioquality (didn't it basically extend the chart after iPod got a 10/10, iAudio got 12/10?)
- Formats played - Awesome variety
- battery time.... makes iPod look like crap that's for sure

Just a few I'd take into account and which seems to be the most important ones to me when deciding. I know UI will be an issue, but since I got more than 50 in IQ, I can actually manage some other UI than a spinning wheel...

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #6 – 2005-12-07 17:23:50

refixed, your criteria for a DAP is exactly like mine. If I were to buy one it would be between the iAudio X5L and the ipod, depending on which one gets Rockbox firmware first. Last time I checked, both were in the works but neither was finished. I have a Neuros 80gb which is fine, but I don't think Rockbox will be made for it. Also this model (NII) is discontinued now.

Were you using the HD 280s on the iriver? I have read that the 280s don't have much bass impact and sometimes need EQ to increase the bass (regardless of the source driving them).

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #7 – 2005-12-07 17:29:02

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Many here seems to be iPod owners, and it seems to be one of those items everyone "must have". However, I still haven't heard something reasonably good to why? most use the term "It's cool" and then you ask them, whatabout quality, and they go

I'll be happy to tell you why I went w/ the 5g ipod and am a happy customer...
-case design. this 60gb 5g ipod is the perfect size & look for me
-storage space. 60gb is a good amount for me
-video capability. it's a BIT lacking in the codecs dept. but it still suits my needs (I can watch south park just fine)
-the other litte features the add in. I can play doom! yay! I can throw on my calendar & contacts as well.

that said, the sound quality is great & the menu system is more intuitive than any other DAP I've owned.

Hope this can help quantify the points of the 5g ipod rather than the vague answers I'll agree with you about!

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #8 – 2005-12-07 17:42:32

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- battery time.... makes iPod look like crap that's for sure
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=348348"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

The 60GB iPod plays for 21 hours, while the iAudio X5 is listed at 14

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #9 – 2005-12-07 18:43:18

The X5L is listed at 35 hours. Nothing can make 21 hours look like crap, but still he was talking about the X5L.

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #10 – 2005-12-07 19:20:39

If you are concerned chiefly with sound quality, then I doubt that anyone will argue against a JetAudio player. They are one of the only ones, to my knowledge, to support FLAC. Which is obviously of higher quality than lossy formats. I have also been told that they are, electronically speaking, cleaner in their amplification.

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #11 – 2005-12-07 23:16:11

The iAudio X5L plays FLAC, as well.

Any X5 or X5L users here? I'm curious if you're truly happy with the unit.

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #12 – 2005-12-07 23:18:57

Quote

I'm wanting to purchase a portable MP3 player. The most important thing about it, which is going to make the sale, is audio quality - I want it to sound as good as possible for a portable device (both in terms of the mp3 decoding quality, and the audio chip itself?)

Not as important, but: I'd also like things such as reasonable storage (20G plus, more the better), OGG (possible FLAC) support, a UI that isn't slow and doesn't suck, and possible high quality audio recording via internal mic/line-in suitable for sampling random noises, but audio quality is really the big thing.

I'm planning on mostly using a pair of Sennheiser HD-280 headphones with it and various earphones, but also running it back into a mixer or two hooked up to monitors.

The iAudio X5L looks the most tempting so far, but I'm looking for people who have truly compared it against other offerings. I can be tempted into buying an iPod, but have heard that the 3rd/4th/5th generation iPods have much crappier sound than the earlier generations due to a different (not as good) audio chip being used or something?

I tried an iRiver H10 for a little while but really wasn't all that impressed with it - I'd prefer not to use an equaliser if possible (I like my music reproduced accurately), but found I had to use it extensively to get decent sound out of it. Is the H320 any better in terms of audio quality?

Advice appreciated.

Thanks.
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=348319"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Sounds a lot to me like the H320 or the X5L is right for you. The H3xx series is a completely different beast than the H10 and considered far superior.

Another added bonus to an H320 is that it already has an early version of a working Rockbox port, so you'll have support for a multitude of codecs and gapless playback.

The X5L is an awesome unit too and you get that amazing battery life. Also in line for a Rockbox port as well.

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #13 – 2005-12-07 23:25:26

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Sounds a lot to me like the H320 or the X5L is right for you. The H3xx series is a completely different beast than the H10 and considered far superior.

Sweet. I wish I saw the H320 originally; it's actually only ever so slightly more expensive than the H10 (like, $10 or something). Damn.

Have there been any comparisons in terms of sound quality, though (esp. driving something such as the HD-280's, which appear to need a little more power)? That's what's going to sell me on the thing :-)

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #14 – 2005-12-08 05:31:25

bump - nobody?

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #15 – 2005-12-08 06:10:32

dont buy creative zen products.
they are by far one of the three womost RMA'ede products in my shop

Creative Zen
Kiss DVD players/records
Afrey dvd drive for PC

These 3 products are pure crap

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #16 – 2005-12-08 06:29:58

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Otherwise, I've found that Creative's players work very well for me - their extensive experience with audio cards definitely shows.
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=348338"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

If anything I'd think Creative's questionable sound quality on many of their sound cards, horrible support and tendancy to build hardware with ridiculous compatability problems would be a pretty strong reason to stay away from their DAP.

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #17 – 2005-12-08 21:26:07

hi,
I can second the apple ipod G5. Very good very happy if it is what you want etc. (IE your music is tagged, your ok with using itunes)

also the x5 is very good... but different. Sound quality wise I dont know which one is better but I am shure you cant hear the difference.

I can hear a slight difference between the shuffle (best sound quality) and the G5. Bass is slightly more defined and rolled off but its nothing you would ever notice if you didnt switch headphone output between the players.
Apple fixed the ipod sound quality issues.

PS: Creative has a brand new mp3 player out (to compete against the G5).

the choice is yours. and it is not an easy choice

Shure E4C headphones

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #18 – 2005-12-08 22:36:58

Hi.Its a hard question you ask.

I always use Koss KSC 35's and have owned a MuVo and an Ipod mini. With the same phones I have heard a 2nd gen 20 gig ipod and an iriver flash player using 128kbit "ish" ogg files.

Broad strokes. The 20 gig ipod had easily the most power and was very clean although a bit piercing when up loud.

The ipod mini sounds the best to my ears.Lots of power clean and smoother in the highs.

The iriver unit was also very good sounding with less power.The SNR was not as good as the other 3.Audible hiss but not enough to bother you if you were on the go.

The MuVo has the least power but is exceptionally clean with excellent bass. It's always been my favourite because of size but 128megs doesn't cut it with -V1 Lame files.

I can't comment on any other players except my old Sony cd player which was inferior to all of the above in power and clarity despite specs suggesting otherwise. They should stick there their crap equipment up their DRM'd asses says I and I thank them for helping me decide on an xbox 360 instead of the ps3.

But I digress....

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #19 – 2005-12-08 23:58:40

Quote

Quote
...their extensive experience with audio cards definitely shows.
You must be joking! Just search here at HA for Creative and you'll see!
Don't get me wrong, they are experienced in making audio HW but they are definitely not considered as the audio HW leader!
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=348347"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I never said they were the leader. I only said that their experience shows. Creative's audio cards have rated pretty highly on review sites also. A lot of the critcism of Creative that I've read here seems to center on the effect their enhancements have on the audio being played. I've been the owner of an Audigy 2 NX USB2.0 card for almost 2 years and I've loved every bit of it. I like the effects added to the audio that can make a track sound completely different. G-Unit's Wanna Get to Know You, for example, sounds like it's being played by a live band if you turn on the EAX "Theater" DSP setting during playback. No, it's not how the song was intended to sound, but it's a nice rendition. Think of it as an automatic remix of sorts. I have other examples but I won't get into them.

My only strike against Creative is their marketing department seems to get carried away in some of the claims they make. Common sense and reading reviews before purchase usually eliminate such concerns.

By the way, if you have any other brand you'd recommend instead of them, please point me to review site. No offense but I rarely make purchases based on forum comments, I always read actual reviews. I'm aware of Terratec and M-audio but reviews for their stuff seem to be few and far between.

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #20 – 2005-12-09 00:53:33

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No offense but I rarely make purchases based on forum comments, I always read actual reviews. I'm aware of Terratec and M-audio but reviews for their stuff seem to be few and far between.
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=348756"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Well maybe this is pointing out the obvious, but this forum's average knowlege about audio (and that includes soundcards obviously) are worth well more than an "actual review", whatever that means. Do you mean an actual review is one by a paid reviewer at Cnet or similar, general site? If I'm looking for recommendations on anything audio, I come here and read because I know that the people here are way more knowlegeable about audio than some hack who reviews stuff for a living and publishes it on general tech sites.

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #21 – 2005-12-09 00:57:23

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Well maybe this is pointing out the obvious, but this forum's average knowlege about audio (and that includes soundcards obviously) are worth well more than an "actual review", whatever that means. Do you mean an actual review is one by a paid reviewer at Cnet or similar, general site? If I'm looking for recommendations on anything audio, I come here and read because I know that the people here are way more knowlegeable about audio than some hack who reviews stuff for a living and publishes it on general tech sites.
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I didn't mean that forums are of no value, they are valuable. However reviews tend to be a lot better at succintly presenting an overview of the general features of a product that is much easier to digest and interpret than disjointed comments from several people, however expert they may be.

By the way, Creative will be integrating its X-Fi technology into their MP3 players soon:

[a href="http://www.tgdaily.com/2005/12/08/creative_zen_visionm_feature/]http://www.tgdaily.com/2005/12/08/creative...isionm_feature/[/url]

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #22 – 2005-12-09 01:22:25

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By the way, Creative will be integrating its X-Fi technology into their MP3 players soon:

http://www.tgdaily.com/2005/12/08/creative...isionm_feature/
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=348769"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Sounds like snake oil to me:

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They also alluded to integrating the X-Fi audio technology into their MP3 players in the near future, with de Bonis stressing to the fact that the Next Big Thing that Creative had in store for its audio playing market would be integration of a scaled-down X-Fi chip into their audio players.

Considering the power of the X-Fi this presents some exciting prospects for dramatically enhancing the sound quality from the company's audio players, though as always the proof will be in the eating, and much may depend on how much Creative engineers have to cut down in order to get X-Fi to work in an audio player almost the same size as the actual full-scale soundcard.

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #23 – 2005-12-09 05:13:13

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Sounds like snake oil to me:
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=348776"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

How so? Clearly you can't increase the quality of a file, but you can make it sound different via DSP in a way that a listener's ears may interpret as a better sound. I absolutely love Creative's EAX and CMSS features. No, it won't make a 128kbps file sound like a CD, and in absolute terms the quality won't be increased, but it's hard to deny the difference it makes in the sound. That's the entire point.

Highest audio quality portable MP3 player

Reply #24 – 2005-12-09 06:04:36

I believe that when people come to HA.org to ask for views on 'better sound', they are asking for stuff that reproduces audio as close as possible to the original recording. Not for stuff that enhances treble or bass or anything that tricks the brain into thinking so.

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