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Topic: Problem With Vbr In Divx (Read 9035 times) previous topic - next topic
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Problem With Vbr In Divx

I'm having this problem with VBR MP3 audio playback in DivX. Sound cracks and pops and in the mp3 decoder properties the sync lost value is increasing. It only happens in WMP and other divx players and only with VBR mp3 movies. There are no audio problems in games or other apps or playing VBRmp3 in WinAmp.
I've tried the onboard audio instead of my SBlive, WinXP or Win98SE, installed the VIA 4-in-1 drivers and VIA PCI latency patch but nothing helps.
The only thing that works is if i register the l3mpg123.ax dshow filter, which improves the sound quality, but it's still not perfect and it makes WMP crash on some occasions. I also tried the Moonlight Odio dekoda but it sounds worse then the default filter.

I read in this http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&t...&threadid=32453 topic that there's a new version of l3codecx.ax , does anyone know where to get it??

my hardware:
ECS K7VTA3 KT 333
AMD Athlon XP 1700+
256 MB DDR RAM
Winfast GF2MX400 64MB
Creative SBlive value
WinXP and WIN98SE dual boot

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #1 –
Ooooffff....
This has been said a zillion times already.

AVI files DO NOT support VBR, period. VBR with AVI files is a HACK, nothing more. You simply CAN NOT expect AVI files to play video well with VBR MP3's.
Solution: FORGET about AVI and use OGM iinstead. Use OggMux which can be downloaded from here under "AVI editing tools".

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #2 –
avi's with mp3 vbr audio work fine for me.  if they ever get slightly out of sync, just pause and resume.  many major divx release groups release stuff with vbr mp3's, and none release with ogg...  that says something about the "hack's" usability.

my guess is that its likely a via chipset conflict with the sblive, but then onboard sound should work ok. ? I'm sorry Tomas, I'm uncertain what your problem could be.

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #3 –
I personally recommend ogm above anyhing else currently available when macking dvd backups. The reasons are at least three:
1. Super-fast searching (aligned to keyframes) and excellent sync. Especially useful when it comes to cd playback of the movie.
2. Vorbis sound, which save your highly valuable bits for better visual quality. I encode the Vorbis audio somewhere between 70 and 95 kbps, depending on the final video size output.
3. If you care about subtitles, ogm is the easiest and smoothest technology for choosing subtitles in different languages on playback.

To playback to work, look for Ogg Directshow Filters (0.9.9.5) and Ogg Subtitle Filter Collection 1.4.0.0). If you intend to encode the video with Divx5, I recommend ffdshow playback filter.

Ogm is a huge step forward when it comes to gaining a better video quality.

Emanuel

Edited: Updated to the new versions of the filters, available since yesterday).

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #4 –
many major divx release groups release stuff with vbr mp3's, and none release with ogg...  that says something about the "hack's" usability.

Release groups typically don't know much about technical details, they just find settings that look good.  Some don't even manage that (uncropped black borders, bad/woeful IVTC, etc.).

http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=38615&cid=4134450 (account of Avery's findings regarding VBR MP3, with dead link to google cache)

http://prak.org/pipermail/avifile/2002-August.txt (email archive of the work mplayer's developers had to do to emulate Microsoft's bug allowing VBR MP3 in AVI)

-h

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #5 –
Tis true, I have seen quite a few bad releases (bad deinterlacing is the worst).  But the 'major' release groups rarely screw up and I've had next to no problems with any of their rips using vbr mp3.  Of course, keeping the ac3 track is always preferable

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #6 –
Afaik, the "major release groups" are not using avi, but svcd. That's a big difference.

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #7 –
The release groups (and most people using AVI who know what they're doing) use ABR, not VBR. The confusion is because ABR is often referred to as VBR.

ABR doesn't really cause too many problems in movies if done correctly (although it is still a 'hack') whereas true VBR does.

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #8 –
He means the major DivX releasing groups..
Man, this topic is so illegal ..

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #9 –
any suggestions on how to turn a divx+vbr-mp3 video into "something decent" without having to transcode/re-encode the audio track? 
A riddle is a short sword attached to the next 2000 years.

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #10 –
Quote
Man, this topic is so illegal ..

Talking about compression techniques is not illegal in my country
We are not infringing any copyrights by talking.

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #11 –
use virtualdub, in audio settings choose AVI Audio, Direct Stream copy, then File -> Save WAV. It will save a wav file that actually contains the MP3 data. rename the .wav extension to MP3, play it to check if you want.
Voila .

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #12 –
Quote
any suggestions on how to turn a divx+vbr-mp3 video into "something decent" without having to transcode/re-encode the audio track?  

Sure. OggMux 0.9.3 should do it all for you, as long as you have the filter collections mentioned above. I haven't tried vbr-mp3 + divx in ogg myself, but Oggmux do support it (along with vorbis, aac and ac3).

Just point the videostream to you avi-file, add the mp3-stream and possible srt subtitle files and you're set.

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #13 –
Quote
Quote
Man, this topic is so illegal ..

Talking about compression techniques is not illegal in my country
We are not infringing any copyrights by talking.

Hahaha.. of course not. I mean, he posts a link to a topic made by a person who cracked DivX and various thiings, then there's releasing groups talk..  It's pretty funny.

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #14 –
Quote
I haven't tried vbr-mp3 + divx in ogg myself, but Oggmux do support it (along with vorbis, aac and ac3).

heh. i tried exactly that right before i posted my question.. works fine as far as oggmux is concerned, but it crashed the player apps i've tried (ZoomPlayer and WiMP). probably a bug in the ogg splitter? (using OggDS 0.9.9.5)
A riddle is a short sword attached to the next 2000 years.

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #15 –
I think there's a new version. Go to doom9.net.

(hmm no, same version, but only added yesterday?? that's strange)

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #16 –
Ahh, that's bad. Try using Windows Media Player 6.4 (not for permanent use, but to figure out where the problems are). If you have Me or XP, just run mplayer2 to fire it up.

Emanuel

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #17 –
well, interesting. wimp 6.4 doesn't crash - the video plays fine, but the sound is weird/echoey (if that's even a word  )

*slaps self for using vbr-mp3 in countless concert vidcaps*
A riddle is a short sword attached to the next 2000 years.

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #18 –
Quote
The release groups (and most people using AVI who know what they're doing) use ABR, not VBR. The confusion is because ABR is often referred to as VBR.

VBR and ABR are both "variable bitrate", meaning that the mp3 frames have different sizes. VBR and ABR are just two different methods of choosing how big a frame should be. You can't be sure by looking at a file, if it was encoded using ABR or VBR.

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #19 –
due to the very quick averaging in abr files, there are no significant bitrate fluctuations over longer periods of time - guess that's why divx+abr-mp3 is not quite as problematic as divx+vbr-mp3. still, it's quite a dirty hack.
A riddle is a short sword attached to the next 2000 years.

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #20 –
Quote
avi's with mp3 vbr audio work fine for me.


You are a minority here.

Quote
if they ever get slightly out of sync, just pause and resume.


That does not always work.

Quote
many major divx release groups release stuff with vbr mp3's,


That still does not make it a smart thing to do. Most of these major groups honestly are not that knowledgable of the overall process and its results.

Quote
and none release with ogg...


Wong. They do indeed.

Quote
that says something about the "hack's" usability.


It says simply that it works for them and they don't give a rats arse about compatability or anyone else and their problems.

Quote
my guess is that its likely a via chipset conflict with the sblive, but then onboard sound should work ok. ? I'm sorry Tomas, I'm uncertain what your problem could be.


VIA is fairly bad on many points. But this is oddly enough a problem pretty much stemming solely from Microsoft. AVI is a Microsoft format. Microsoft with their infinant foreseight did not take into account VBR audio. Add on top of that the fact that Microsoft's directshow filter is broken when it comes to VBR MP3. On top of that it can be a pain to remove the MS decoder and get it to use another one. And even if you did the format is still deficient and causes lack of synchronisation. There is abosolutely no way to achieve synch with VBR MP3 in AVI. It will never be in synch. It may or may not get way out of synch. But it is never in synch like CBR MP3.
editing

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #21 –
Stupid question, but better check for sure : Thomas Otto, did you use a VBR-compatible AVI program to make the DivX ? Like Virtual dub VBR edition ?

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #22 –
Quote
avi's with mp3 vbr audio work fine for me.  if they ever get slightly out of sync, just pause and resume.  many major divx release groups release stuff with vbr mp3's, and none release with ogg...  that says something about the "hack's" usability.

Release groups also say that we should encode CDs in CBR 192 with simple stereo turned on. Obviously, release groups are a bunch of 1337ist morons.

Ogg stream is the best way to go for movie rips with VBR audio streams whether VBR MP3 or Ogg Vorbis.

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #23 –
Quote
Quote
avi's with mp3 vbr audio work fine for me.  if they ever get slightly out of sync, just pause and resume.  many major divx release groups release stuff with vbr mp3's, and none release with ogg...  that says something about the "hack's" usability.

Release groups also say that we should encode CDs in CBR 192 with simple stereo turned on. Obviously, release groups are a bunch of 1337ist morons.

Ogg stream is the best way to go for movie rips with VBR audio streams whether VBR MP3 or Ogg Vorbis.

Who came up with that rule anyway? (Must encode mp3s in CBR 192kbps Stereo)

Problem With Vbr In Divx

Reply #24 –
Quote
Quote
and none release with ogg...


Wong. They do indeed.

Hmm..  I certainly have never seen it.  I have nothing against ogg for movies (except when used at very low bitrates), just as I have nothing against vbr-mp3.  Both work fine, and the systems I run are hardly special. p2-450 on a bx mobo, tbird 1.4 on a amd 760, and p4 2.1 on a sis645, all running win2k.

As an aside, Neo Neko, no offense meant but that style of quoting every phrase in a post(s) is very irritating.