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Topic: Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx? (Read 12752 times) previous topic - next topic
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Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Which codec is recommended when I don't want to spend my time carefully tweaking settings across multiple runs, applying just the right amount of smoothing and denoising etc.

I just want to setup the codecs for example according to the guides at doom9.org and encode away, never touching these settings again. Which codec will yield better results without further tweaking? Once the codecs have been setup, all I want to do is crop, resize and choose the number of CDs.

I am fine with running VirtualDub(Mod) or Gordianknot and choosing resolution/bitrate according to compressibility test.

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #1 –
Divx will give very good result without tweaking. Xvid is known to need more tweaking to perform optimal.

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #2 –
You can still get good quality with XviD without any crazy tweaking.  DivX is easier to configure, but I think XviD will probably pip it in terms of quality (just follow doom9's XviD 1.0 guide).

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #3 –
Thx for the replies! I'd test myself, but the only material I have here right now is the "Monster's, Inc." DVD which I guess is a special case, being pure CGI.

I am not scared of somewhat difficult configuring, but I don't want to adapt these settings for every new movie I encode. I am aware that "one size fits all" isn't as good as "custom taylored", but I'm willing to make that compromise.

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #4 –
DivX is probably the way to go then. I've been testing the new XviD betas (i.e. 1.0) and have found it can do some really screwed up things on some videos.  Here are the settings for Divx 5.1.1.

First Pass: Std. Mode, No GMC, No QPel, No PVE, B-Frames Enabled, No MVFile.

Second Pass: Std. Mode, No GMC, No QPel, No PVE, B-Frams Enabled, No MVFile, Update Log File.

Third Pass: Slowest Mode, No GMC, No QPel, PVE Fast/Slow, B-Frames Enabled, No MVFile.

Fast mode of PVE is more rigourous than slow mode.  It potentially could result in artifacts.  Slow mode should have no visual artifacts.

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #5 –
xvid produces great results with the default settings

note that it can be good to use h263 for 1cd rips and mpeg quant for 2cd rips, also set vhq to 4 and use twopass of course (3 passes as divx5 might need is far too much imho), you can also try trellis and qpel (i always use them)
I know, that I know nothing (Socrates)

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #6 –
Hm, I was afraid there'd be such a "consensus".
I take it that I won't be disapointed by either codec. I also guess that there aren't any other serious alternatives. (No, I won't use Windows Media).

How is the legal situation? DivX Networks is paying mpeg4 license fees, yes, making the use of DivX 5 legal. I guess that makes using XviD illegal then, as long as I don't pay any fees. Are there any plans to market the finnished XviD codec? I think this is a point worth considering.

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #7 –
spreading mpeg-4 codec binaries is illegal without paying license fees
I know, that I know nothing (Socrates)

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #8 –
Spreading the source code, which Xvid developers do, is considered to be legal. Spreading compiled binaries is considered to be illegal if the license fees aren't paid.

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #9 –
For GC/animation movies there's a CG/anime custom matrix. Give it a try, makes a big difference. Unfortunately, I don't have a download-link handy.

Other than that, if encoding speed ain't an issue, I'd say: quarterpel, trellis, b-frames, vhq=4, GMC (ONLY in combination with VHQ), NO adaptive quantization (on animated sources), perhaps cartoon mode (try it) and no filtering in avisynth whatsoever.

As for DivX or XviD, consult Doom9's new codec comparison.

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #10 –
t.g.deck, the CG-Animation matrix comes with Koepi's beta3, if you look in the XviD folder you will find a zip with tons of matrices.  But that said I do _not_ recommend that matrix except maybe if you are doing really high bitrates.  When I have used it in the past it has not done very well at all and blocks very easily.  Other than that I agree 100%.  As for filtering, the only time I do lots of filtering is on toons and anime where it can make a big difference.  Other than that I tend to avoid it as well.

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #11 –
Well, I use different builds and have collected my matrices from links on the forum. So I wasn't quite aware that Koepi's build included the matrix; I never looked for it.

Yes, the CG-matrix is not designed for low bitrates.

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #12 –
Which is best for 1CD rips.  Movies which are about 2.5 Hours long ?

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #13 –
Quote
Which is best for 1CD rips.  Movies which are about 2.5 Hours long ?

there is no best 
the best is to do your own tests

but for very low bitrates rv9 probably isnt a bad choice, tough you could get the same results (perhaps sharper ones) if you use xvid for that with avisynth filtering...
I know, that I know nothing (Socrates)

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #14 –
1 cd rip for movie that long?

that won't look good regardless to settings/codec....(hmm..i too intended to mention rv9 but this is mpeg4 forum..  )
filtering would need to be very agressive to achieve this (agressive filtering brings artefacts if itt's own)

and to answer original question;i would pick xvid over divx5....latest defaults are well picked!you only need to adjust the bitrate..(to fit your targets)..

also,from the legal standpoint usage of xvid is illegal...but  not all countries have US-like laws on this...and also; what police is checking codecs installed on your PC anyhow?(the one (police) people would destroy immediately?)

my PC,my(  ) software on it,i use what i wan't for my private purposes....as i'm not making money on this....

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #15 –
Quote
Which is best for 1CD rips.  Movies which are about 2.5 Hours long ?

fffffffft....
 

Maybe you can do it if you make it an XCD (800MB) with stereo HE AAC sound and keep your resolution reasonable (<608x). H.263-quantizer.

You could also work with tricks and encode the movie reverse-anamorphically; i.e. encode for example with an odd horizontal res like 400 and let it resize by entering a horizontal resolution of 608 in the mkv-container. Or work with XviD's aspect-ratio options. Both require proper decoding methods, of course.

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #16 –
Quote
Quote
Which is best for 1CD rips.  Movies which are about 2.5 Hours long ?

fffffffft....
why not, its a nice thing to play around with
also the hvs_good matrix will do a good job for low bitrates

Quote
also,from the legal standpoint usage of xvid is illegal...but  not all countries have US-like laws on this...and also; what police is checking codecs installed on your PC anyhow?

what law is that?
its illegal to spread (dunno about downloading) xvid binaries
but you can perfectly do your own compiles and use these without a legal problem to my knowledge
I know, that I know nothing (Socrates)

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #17 –
mpegla [ http://www.mpegla.com/ ] won't like that!
is ASKS for anyone that uses mpeg4 patents to PAY THEM some fees....(because they made mpeg4)
divx5 is paying with the advertising etc.
xvid is not......(and it uses mpeg4 patents)

therefore,ENCODING with xvid is illegal...(no matter if you compiled it yourself or otherwise..)
but as i hinted,i couldn't care less about mpegla and whatever...

take a look at licensees list(no xvid here);

List of MPEG LA, LLC's MPEG-4 Visual Licensees and Affiliates in good standing, based on information currently available to MPEG LA, LLC.
3ivx Technologies Pty. Ltd.
Ahead Software
AKI Digital Electrical Appliance Co., Ltd.
Amont Security Products
ANDI GmbH
Anystream, Inc.
AutoTOOLS Group Co., Ltd.
BroadQ, LLC
Canon, Inc.
Carry Computer Eng. Co., Ltd
Casio Computer Co., Ltd.
Casio Soft Co., Ltd.
Cezy International Limited
Chowsons International Inc.
Cinapse Networks Co., Ltd.
Cisco Systems, Inc.
Cloanto Italia srl
Codex Novus, Inc.
Crypton Future Media, Inc.
Curitel Communications, Inc.
dicas digital image coding GmbH
DivXNetworks, Inc.
E-Genie Australia Pty. Ltd.
eAcceleration Corp
Eastern Asia Technology Limited
Eastman Kodak Company
Endocardial Solutions, Inc.
Enlight Corporation
Fandango, Inc.
Fraunhofer-Gesellschaft zur Foerderung der Angewandten Forschung e.V.
Fujitsu Limited
G-Star Communications Inc.
General Instrument Corporation
Guangzhou Panyu Juda Car Audio Equipment Co. Ltd.
High Tech Computer Corp.
Hitachi Ltd.
Hitachi Hybrid Network Co., Ltd.
IndigoVision Limited
Intercube Co., Ltd.
iVAST Inc
J Anime.com Co. Ltd.
KDDI Corporation
KDDI R&D Laboratories Inc.
KDDI Technology Corporation
Koninklijke Philips Electronics N.V.
Kyocera Corporation
Kyocera Wireless Corp.
LG Electronics, Inc.
Matsushita Electric Industrial Co., Ltd.
Matsushita Kotobuki Electronics Industries, Ltd.
MDI Security Systems
Media Excel, Inc.
Megachips Corporation
Microsoft Corporation
Mitsubishi Electric Corporation
NEC Corporation
NEC Personal Products, Ltd.
Neos Interactive Limited
Nextreaming Corp.
Nokia
NTT Electronics Corporation
Oki Electric Industry Co., Ltd.
Olympus Corporation
PacketVideo Corporation
Panasonic Communications Co. , Ltd
Panasonic Mobile Communications Co., Ltd.
Photodex Corporation
Plala Networks, Inc.
Pony Canyon Inc.
Popwire Stockholm AB
PT Matsushita Kotobuki Electronics Industries Indonesia
Quick CCTV Ltd.
Rhythmication Co., Ltd.
Roxio, Inc
Samsung Electronics Co., Ltd.
SANYO Electric Co., Ltd.
Saver K.K.
Sercomm Corporation
Sharp Kabushiki Kaisha
Softel Limited
Sony Corporation
Sony Ericsson Mobile Communications AB
Sony Ericsson Mobile Communications Japan, Inc.
Sorenson Media, Inc.
TDK Corporation
Thomson
Toshiba Corporation
VBrick Systems, Inc.
Victor Company of Japan, Limited
VidSoft GmbH
Vqual Limited
Zhongshan Kenloon Digital Technology Co., Ltd.

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #18 –
Quote
mpegla [ http://www.mpegla.com/ ] won't like that!
is ASKS for anyone that uses mpeg4 patents to PAY THEM some fees....(because they made mpeg4)
divx5 is paying with the advertising etc.
xvid is not......(and it uses mpeg4 patents)

therefore,ENCODING with xvid is illegal...(no matter if you compiled it yourself or otherwise..)
but as i hinted,i couldn't care less about mpegla and whatever...

no, not encoding is illegal, spreading/selling mpeg-4 products without paying license fees is illegal

or do you have to pay license fees, when you encode with divx5?
I know, that I know nothing (Socrates)

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #19 –
nope bond..using illegal codecs is also illegal....i see stux reading this..stux,how did 3ivx managed to pay the fees?
 

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #20 –
xvid isnt an illegal codec 

its perfectly legal to develop mpeg-4 codecs for educational purposes, you dont have to pay licensing fees in that case, in fact thats what xvid, divx4, ffmpeg, ffvfw, faac and whatever else exists do...

plz stop spreading your guessings as facts...
I know, that I know nothing (Socrates)

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #21 –
yeap,it's illegal....check out what temporance said here
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?thre...0&pagenumber=10
that si my statndpoint too...
Quote
"Legal encode using xvid" is an oxymoron.


Quote
plz stop spreading your guessings as facts...

well either i'm guessing or you are...now,make an xvid encoding and brag about it..send mpegla an email..se how they feel about u using their stuff without paying for it....

i told you,it's illegal,but i don't care...
there's no such thing as "educational purpose"!
you are making videos with this stuff,you're not examining the source code!
it's the same as you can't put an windows XP PC in the PC-shop window if you didn't had a purchased version of win-xp!same thing!
they are putting linux now on those window-shop machines....

alike,you shouldn't make xvid encoding publicly available!hide them,or you may get caught!
as is visible,divx5 and 3ivx users have no fears....trhey pay $$$ to mpegla...

and to answer one of your previous questions;
Quote
or do you have to pay license fees, when you encode with divx5?

no,i don't,but dxn does!
it si paying with the money it gets from advertising(or it is advertising some company that let dxn use license...ie. they break it even that way...) or it's paying with the money it gets from selling pro versions....

the law says that anyone using mpeg4 patents should pay to mpegla....but don't worry bond..i won't tell anyone u're using xvid(  )

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #22 –
So basically the situation is the same as with LAME?

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #23 –
i4004

read what stux from 3ivx (i expect guys from companies who have to do with this stuff to know what is the case) wrote in the same thread:

"There are MPEG "use" fees in some situations, most normal users probably wouldn't qualify.

It essentially comes down to is the use "for profit"... "

so most user dont qualify (as they dont make a profit with their encodes), which also means these user dont infringe mpeg-4 patents/license issues as you or temporance might think...

and check out all the codecs i listed and you will find "for educational purpose"...
if you develop such codecs for edu purpose you are not allowed to spread the binaries, cause than you will have to pay license fees
thats why you dont find any binaries on the sites, from xvid, lame, faac, faad, mad, ffmpeg aso...
on the contrary dxn spread their binaries

nothing more to say about that from my side, believe what you want, but dont tell newbies your guessing as facts...
I know, that I know nothing (Socrates)

Best out of the box quality - Xvid or Divx?

Reply #24 –
Quote
So basically the situation is the same as with LAME?

yes,i believe so..(although i'm not an "lame law"(  ) expert i believe that's the case...)
fraunhofer wants $$$
mpegla wants $$$
but this is hydrogen audio,and someone will correct us if we're wrong on this one....

bond;
stux said;
"There are MPEG "use" fees in some situations, most normal users probably wouldn't qualify.

,but what does "probably" mean?
"probably" DOESN'T MEAN "WITH ALL THE CERTAINTY"....does it?
for example,if i use cracked winxp on my machine and am making NO PROFIT,is that legal?no,it's not!
by your words it would be (and it's NOT)
also,apply that to any crack and any shareware etc.

mpegla asks $$$!it holds the patents as used in xvid and other mpeg4 codecs!

Quote
and check out all the codecs i listed and you will find "for educational purpose"...
if you develop such codecs for edu purpose you are not allowed to spread the binaries, cause than you will have to pay license fees
thats why you dont find any binaries on the sites, from xvid, lame, faac, faad, mad, ffmpeg aso...
on the contrary dxn spread their binaries

bond you're not reading what i said!
yes,sure you're right; it's not alowed to spread binaries (ie. koepi is breaking the law big time!)

dxn CAN spread their binaries because THEY ARE PAYING $$$ to MPEGLA!
ok?
got it now?
it's really simple,i believe!

if you're using xvid to encode video you're technically breaking the law!no two ways about it!
same is with ffvfw and same is with divx3....(although divx3 is a retaliation to ms locking their mpeg4v3 codec..so they got what they deserved!)