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Topic: F2k v2.0 doesn't refresh tags (Read 3598 times) previous topic - next topic
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F2k v2.0 doesn't refresh tags

Hey.

Have new version of foobar, everything's working fine after 1.x, no plugin conflicts etc. but I noticed that it doesn't want refresh tags after editing. eg: artist - title, I change it to artist - title [extended mix] in mp3tag, load files in foobar and see no [extended mix] in title. This problem was in 1.x and I did reload of f2k with an empty playlist, then load files again. Now it doesn't help anymore.
The one thing that helps me is renaming album folder with some new info like artist - title to artist - title [year].

Re: F2k v2.0 doesn't refresh tags

Reply #2 –
foobar2000 never re-reads metadata from tracks if it has the information cached. Prior to foobar2000 v2.0 only tracks in media library and in active playlists were cached. Version 2.0 changed the player to cache everything.

Your issue is caused by your decision to configure MP3Tag to retain the original file timestamps. If the file appears unmodified from foobar2000's perspective it has no need to re-read the information. Parsing the file is slow so it's only done when needed or requested.

You have multiple options:
You can edit tags with foobar2000.
You can configure MP3Tag to not falsify the edit times.
You can force foobar2000 to reload tag information after external edits. There are multiple ways to do this, one is to hold Shift, right click the tracks and use context menu command 'Tagging' -> 'Reload info from file(s)'.

Re: F2k v2.0 doesn't refresh tags

Reply #3 –
Quote from: Case on
foobar2000 never re-reads metadata from tracks if it has the information cached. Prior to foobar2000 v2.0 only tracks in media library and in active playlists were cached. Version 2.0 changed the player to cache everything.

Your issue is caused by your decision to configure MP3Tag to retain the original file timestamps. If the file appears unmodified from foobar2000's perspective it has no need to re-read the information. Parsing the file is slow so it's only done when needed or requested.

You have multiple options:
You can edit tags with foobar2000.
You can configure MP3Tag to not falsify the edit times.
You can force foobar2000 to reload tag information after external edits. There are multiple ways to do this, one is to hold Shift, right click the tracks and use context menu command 'Tagging' -> 'Reload info from file(s)'.

Uhm, this decision is not happening from MP3 tag but from editing in foobar itself, or converting a file again with the same name (example: making an xyz.mp3 with 320kbps instead of 192k)

It is my wish if I want the time stamps retained or not, if I want to keep an iTunes AAC as it is with exception to the Artist Name, or whatever I wish to do... why are we being forced to use a setting that we don't want to?

It'd be really appreciable if the system that was working for the better part of 2 decades stays the same... if not, then give a simple toggle switch for this cache thing in the preferences...

It's an issue for people who use foobar, solely to preview the files while they're in the middle of a bulk conversion process... I don't wanna justify myself further for tagging my files whichever way I please to... I mean seriously?

The things were working just fine for so long... I am used to that workflow and I don't please to change my workflow... I can't keep right-clicking or tapping my keyboard continuously, plus using foobar to edit tags? it's the simplest tag editor known to me, it doesn't integrate well with 3rd party sources for tags, or has scripts, it's good enough for adding basic meta to a few files, but for doing bulk operations or adding bulk custom tags (iTunes et al)... foobar doesn't help, mp3tag solves that out, so not an issue...

I mean how much trouble would it be to add a radio button for this caching thing? Rather than asking everyone to change their workflow and adapt to a new routine, maybe add that simple switch, solves problems in a breeze for everyone, it really does irk when you're in a middle of big copy pasta or library cleaning session...

Seriously guys, this is not even a big issue... it's not even a flagship feature or a really complex one that you would think twice before tweaking, please do the needful and help us out!

Re: F2k v2.0 doesn't refresh tags

Reply #4 –
Quote from: darkalex on
It is my wish if I want the time stamps retained or not, if I want to keep an iTunes AAC as it is with exception to the Artist Name, or whatever I wish to do... why are we being forced to use a setting that we don't want to?
You are not forced to do this. @Case proposed other options without changing the relevant setting.

Quote from: darkalex on
It'd be really appreciable if the system that was working for the better part of 2 decades stays the same... if not, then give a simple toggle switch for this cache thing in the preferences...
Although I don't know the foobar2000 internals, such things are never just simple switches as they affect the whole internal architecture of the application.

Quote from: darkalex on
It's an issue for people who use foobar, solely to preview the files while they're in the middle of a bulk conversion process... I don't wanna justify myself further for tagging my files whichever way I please to... I mean seriously?
Seriously? You are expecting an application to work just like you want, because you even don't consider to change your workflow?

Quote from: darkalex on
The things were working just fine for so long...
And now the things have changed, so what?

Quote from: darkalex on
I am used to that workflow and I don't please to change my workflow...
And why not? Changing a workflow often leads to having a better workflow afterwards.

Quote from: darkalex on
it doesn't integrate well with 3rd party sources for tags
That's wrong. Besides the internal freedb plugin there are also 3rdparty plugins for discogs and musicbrainz. What are you missing?

Quote from: darkalex on
or has scripts
That's even more wrong. Besides the internal masstager, you have also the possibility to use JavaScript or SQL with 3rdparty plugins to script your tagging.

Quote from: darkalex on
but for doing bulk operations or adding bulk custom tags (iTunes et al)... foobar doesn't help
This remains wrong, see above.

Quote from: darkalex on
I mean how much trouble would it be to add a radio button for this caching thing?
Probably a lot, see above.

Quote from: darkalex on
Rather than asking everyone
You are not everyone. Most of the users don't have your problem, which is originating in the first place from your decision to use different independent tools for your workflow.

Quote from: darkalex on
Seriously guys, this is not even a big issue
Again, you are completely underestimating the possible consequences of such a change.

Re: F2k v2.0 doesn't refresh tags

Reply #5 –
Quote from: fbuser on
Quote from: darkalex on
It is my wish if I want the time stamps retained or not, if I want to keep an iTunes AAC as it is with exception to the Artist Name, or whatever I wish to do... why are we being forced to use a setting that we don't want to?
You are not forced to do this. @Case proposed other options without changing the relevant setting.

Quote from: darkalex on
It'd be really appreciable if the system that was working for the better part of 2 decades stays the same... if not, then give a simple toggle switch for this cache thing in the preferences...
Although I don't know the foobar2000 internals, such things are never just simple switches as they affect the whole internal architecture of the application.

Quote from: darkalex on
It's an issue for people who use foobar, solely to preview the files while they're in the middle of a bulk conversion process... I don't wanna justify myself further for tagging my files whichever way I please to... I mean seriously?
Seriously? You are expecting an application to work just like you want, because you even don't consider to change your workflow?

Quote from: darkalex on
The things were working just fine for so long...
And now the things have changed, so what?

Quote from: darkalex on
I am used to that workflow and I don't please to change my workflow...
And why not? Changing a workflow often leads to having a better workflow afterwards.

Quote from: darkalex on
it doesn't integrate well with 3rd party sources for tags
That's wrong. Besides the internal freedb plugin there are also 3rdparty plugins for discogs and musicbrainz. What are you missing?

Quote from: darkalex on
or has scripts
That's even more wrong. Besides the internal masstager, you have also the possibility to use JavaScript or SQL with 3rdparty plugins to script your tagging.

Quote from: darkalex on
but for doing bulk operations or adding bulk custom tags (iTunes et al)... foobar doesn't help
This remains wrong, see above.

Quote from: darkalex on
I mean how much trouble would it be to add a radio button for this caching thing?
Probably a lot, see above.

Quote from: darkalex on
Rather than asking everyone
You are not everyone. Most of the users don't have your problem, which is originating in the first place from your decision to use different independent tools for your workflow.

Quote from: darkalex on
Seriously guys, this is not even a big issue
Again, you are completely underestimating the possible consequences of such a change.


What a bogus response.

I just saw this after a while

When you're not even aware about the internals of this application or simply what change I'm asking about, why bother to post your reply full of semantics and absolutely no useful information or even rationalisation?

Are you kidding me that changing workflow for people is not a big deal? I guess you really don't have any clue as a person who develops user friendly applications for people, no one in their right mind tampers with the existing functionality of an application and mess with the muscle memory of people unless it's a change that's so warranted that not doing it would collapse the whole application

Which metadata caching clearly isn't a issue for, the developer mentioned that foobar is simply caching everything now rather than looking up tags as and when needed, which means that a radio button is indeed applicable in this scenario which asks the user to choose how they want their database managed, cached forever or instantly load from files...

Rather than giving headless replies without even understanding the scenario or the exact problem, please refrain from posting your frankly useless replies. Semantics are not how the real world works. A developer who's accustomed to making products for people knows how big of a deal is to tamper with people's workflow. Especially when the latter can be avoided with a simple radio button, asking people about their preferences for caching, and if this actually seems like a complex issue to you or a problem so big that would collapse the architecture of your application, maybe you should rethink your career and take a refresher course for programming because it's a problem that is so, so easy to solve.

The solutions given by the dev are as equal as asking someone to put a bandage on a fractured leg... might sound good in a bookish world, but isn't even remotely close to how the world works

You think people are going to shift, right click, go to a menu and click reload everytime they wanna drag and drop files in a player? do you realise how big of a hindrance it is when you're working with thousands of files at once or quite frankly making a playlist with a huge number of assorted tracks?

"changing workflow usually leads to better workflow" and what not, keep your semantics to yourself man... that's not how the world works, might be true in your SDLC 101 course, not in the real world. Simply because it's highly bookish and hold absolutely no relevance to how the world works.

"Underestimating the possible consequences of such a change" Really, take a refresher course, at least in English 101... because you clearly did not read the entire explanation here, and just started typing your semantics.. it's like crying wolf everytime someone lights up a matchstick, doesn't mean they're gonna burn the house down... that quite frankly wraps up your entire answer in single line. Get out of the book and think pragmatically. "Completely underestimating the consequences of such a change" My gosh.

Re: F2k v2.0 doesn't refresh tags

Reply #6 –
Quote from: darkalex on
When you're not even aware about the internals of this application...
:))  ::)

You're talking to one of the software authors, so perhaps you should not be so dismissive!
It's your privilege to disagree, but that doesn't make you right and me wrong.

Re: F2k v2.0 doesn't refresh tags

Reply #7 –
Quote from: fooball on
Quote from: darkalex on
When you're not even aware about the internals of this application...
:))  ::)

You're talking to one of the software authors, so perhaps you should not be so dismissive!

Just read theirs and mine response before pulling rank and being dismissive about my post, too..

Just cuz they're a dev does not mean they were right when they said what they did, they made the kind of arguments that you would give to your child for not letting them use a PC >30 mins a day or saying that not sleeping properly at night could give you a brain tumor... true technically but bollocks in real world unless we actually abuse our sleep schedule which def is not the case for staying up once a while, as is the case of making the metadata caching a choice for the user... not rocket science based on which the whole software could collapse as the dev suggested... that's why the dismissive response... because theirs was one too... ykwim

Just read the posts in their own context with fairness, not dismiss the whole thing just by pulling rank..

Re: F2k v2.0 doesn't refresh tags

Reply #8 –
Quote from: Case on
foobar2000 never re-reads metadata from tracks if it has the information cached. Prior to foobar2000 v2.0 only tracks in media library and in active playlists were cached. Version 2.0 changed the player to cache everything.

Your issue is caused by your decision to configure MP3Tag to retain the original file timestamps. If the file appears unmodified from foobar2000's perspective it has no need to re-read the information. Parsing the file is slow so it's only done when needed or requested.

You have multiple options:
You can edit tags with foobar2000.
You can configure MP3Tag to not falsify the edit times.
You can force foobar2000 to reload tag information after external edits. There are multiple ways to do this, one is to hold Shift, right click the tracks and use context menu command 'Tagging' -> 'Reload info from file(s)'.

Such an arrogant, condescending, and passive aggressive response!

What if one happened to need to preserve the original timestamps for file sorting reasons (outside media players and libraries)? And what if one wanted the freedom to tag their files with mp3tag without being guilt-tripped about it?

This is not a feature, it's a liability. The choice to cache metadata versus always load from disk should be kept to the users and not forced upon them.

More important;y, timestamps are such a volatile criteria to base any assumptions of file contents on. I think it's a bad decision to cache metadata of files outside the library.

Re: F2k v2.0 doesn't refresh tags

Reply #9 –
Quote from: darkalex on
Quote from: Case on
foobar2000 never re-reads metadata from tracks if it has the information cached. Prior to foobar2000 v2.0 only tracks in media library and in active playlists were cached. Version 2.0 changed the player to cache everything.

Your issue is caused by your decision to configure MP3Tag to retain the original file timestamps. If the file appears unmodified from foobar2000's perspective it has no need to re-read the information. Parsing the file is slow so it's only done when needed or requested.

You have multiple options:
You can edit tags with foobar2000.
You can configure MP3Tag to not falsify the edit times.
You can force foobar2000 to reload tag information after external edits. There are multiple ways to do this, one is to hold Shift, right click the tracks and use context menu command 'Tagging' -> 'Reload info from file(s)'.

Uhm, this decision is not happening from MP3 tag but from editing in foobar itself, or converting a file again with the same name (example: making an xyz.mp3 with 320kbps instead of 192k)

It is my wish if I want the time stamps retained or not, if I want to keep an iTunes AAC as it is with exception to the Artist Name, or whatever I wish to do... why are we being forced to use a setting that we don't want to?

It'd be really appreciable if the system that was working for the better part of 2 decades stays the same... if not, then give a simple toggle switch for this cache thing in the preferences...

It's an issue for people who use foobar, solely to preview the files while they're in the middle of a bulk conversion process... I don't wanna justify myself further for tagging my files whichever way I please to... I mean seriously?

The things were working just fine for so long... I am used to that workflow and I don't please to change my workflow... I can't keep right-clicking or tapping my keyboard continuously, plus using foobar to edit tags? it's the simplest tag editor known to me, it doesn't integrate well with 3rd party sources for tags, or has scripts, it's good enough for adding basic meta to a few files, but for doing bulk operations or adding bulk custom tags (iTunes et al)... foobar doesn't help, mp3tag solves that out, so not an issue...

I mean how much trouble would it be to add a radio button for this caching thing? Rather than asking everyone to change their workflow and adapt to a new routine, maybe add that simple switch, solves problems in a breeze for everyone, it really does irk when you're in a middle of big copy pasta or library cleaning session...

Seriously guys, this is not even a big issue... it's not even a flagship feature or a really complex one that you would think twice before tweaking, please do the needful and help us out!

Exadtly!